WEBVTT

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[sil.]

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A lot of people have never
seen a Mormon crickets.

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That’s… that’s what they look like,

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and when they’re cool,
they go kind of dormant.

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They’re real cannibalistic,

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they have to keep them cold, they… they eat each other. They bite the legs off
each other and next thing, you know, they’re eating their stomachs out of them

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and they’ll get out on the black top,

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I don’t know what for, but they get out of the black top out of the
highway and the car will run over one and two will run out and eat it.

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We put them in

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these plastic bags, even the paper towel in
there, to absorb their tobacco juice spit

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and if we don’t get them
on ice pretty quick,

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then they just, you know,
start eating on each other.

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See these were totally dormant

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when I pull them out of there, already they’re starting
to warm up enough to they’re starting to wiggle.

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Get them back in here and cool
off again it slow them down.

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[music]

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[music]

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[music]

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[music]

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[music]

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[music]

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My family has delivered
honor or the golf courses

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there and read some along the river,

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uh… told that, \"Jim, just do it.\"
So we all know where we… where we…

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where we used to stay. The Wanapum people
know all where they were situated,

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and we’d have visitors, like
the Umatilla, and Nez Perce

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and even people from Canada,
Montana would come over and trade.

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The winters were quite mild

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down there in Hanford. So many people
move there in the winter time,

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not only was the winter is milder

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but there was an abundance of
fish and were varieties of fish

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could consume out of Columbia River system
year around. This whole valley right here,

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where all these domestic crops are grown

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consisted of a tremendous
amount of fruits and medicine.

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When they eventually forced
us onto this reservation,

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our forefathers made the
provision and the treaty

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that we would forever be able to
utilize this land that we once roamed.

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That Tri Cities sits at
this incredible junction,

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the Snake, the Columbia, the
Yakama, the Walla Walla,

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they’re all coming in there and
ecologically what a spot. This is a…

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a huge no to native settlement, but
then after the natives are removed

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and you begin to get a few farmers in
their, fish aren’t resource anymore,

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they’re not focused on
fish and plants foods.

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In fact, you look at the early maps of that area
and everything that isn’t right on the river

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or you can dig a little tiny ditch too is
classified on the government maps is a wasteland.

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Well, these are Native American
grocery stores. So for one culture,

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this is… this is a safe way that this
desert setting with all of its plant foods,

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the next one that comes along, it’s a wasteland.
It’s no good if you can’t irrigate or graze it.

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The future was going to be there in the…

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in the middle of the valley.
Orchards and vineyards and…

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and crops of one kind or another that would
have changed that landscape entirely,

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all it needed was water.

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It… it appears to be very worthless
but boy, you put water on

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and you’ve got something.

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[music]

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White bluff at that time was about

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500 people that just a guess.

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Hanford was about 350 downriver.

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It was a little town, that’s all.

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Had a grocery store and a drug store

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and we had a paper and a… a bank,
a pool hall, only one of each.

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[music]

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When the Manhattan Project was considered

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in a place to move to… to…
to build our weaponry,

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Hanford was considered.

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They needed a place where there was an abundance
of clear cool water and that they knew,

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they had to have to cool their reactor.
They needed a… an area

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that would provide power

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and they also said that this area was a…

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isolated wasteland and the
people were expendable.

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We were just getting ready to harbor start

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first crop of apricots, at the
time that the government moved in,

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and moved us out. My folks got the notice

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that they had to move and
they had 28 days to move

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and the only explanation given to them

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because it was such a
highly secret setup was

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that it was needed for the war effort.

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They played up the patriotism type
of thing very, very strongly.

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That was it, the war effort
and so you couldn’t…

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you couldn’t fight it because
you’re… you loved your country

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and you wouldn’t want to,
so what else, you know,

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what else is there to do. Nothing.

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It was a massive evacuation.

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There were people that would pack
up everything they could pack up

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and that meet maybe on the
Main Street in White Bluff

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with a neighbor that was also headed
out and that the conversation

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you’d say, \"Well, where are you going?\"
And the answer was, \"I don’t know,\"

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There was no place to go.

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The Yakama people would never
accept any compensation,

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we were under the impression
that once war effort was over,

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we would continue our treaty rights go back there
and fish and to hunger and to gather food,

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and uh… and continue the way of life.
Many of our people went to war

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with them for the United States,

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and we lost many people in that
war, and we assumed that a…

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that when that was over, we would
continue with our lives so we buried

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our fishing equipment down uh… in the sand,

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canoes, nets, etcetera, and left them.

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[sil.]

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There wasn’t much there when the first…
when I first (inaudible) because I…

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we came in there right at the very
beginning of it. Being as young as I was,

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and we drove out here, I kept looking

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and kept saying, \"Well, mom where are
the Indians? Where’s the Indians?\"

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I was 10 years old, you know, you know, I was
expecting to see Indians on horseback, you know,

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you know with carrion bows and arrows
and stuff. I was really expected

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to go to the Wild West. My father came here

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in May of 1943. He was one of
the first (inaudible) workers

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on the project. He was a
carpenter and they… they built

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the initial barracks and
stuff where workers lived,

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when the mass of workers got to Hanford.

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That town went from… from couple of 100
people to 50,000 people in less than a year.

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If you went from White Bluff to Hanford,

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you saw some of it all around our area.
They were digging up everything,

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you know, turned down everything, putting
in a lot of piping or something,

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you know, there was a lot of stuff going on.
Nobody had any idea what it was. Uh-uh.

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It was not supposed to know and they
didn’t. They ever pretty good at that.

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I didn’t you. Didn’t have a clue.

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Nobody did. We knew something
really secret was going on.

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That’s all we knew until they dropped the bomb,
when they dropped the first bomb on Hiroshima,

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then it came out, up until then
it was never talked about.

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[sil.]

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[music]

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What’s it… what’s it been in the military,

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uh… you never forget it.

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I… I still remember my army serial number,

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I can’t remember my telephone number.
It’s a different… different experience.

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I remember the dust devils

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that after the nuclear explosions in
the Nevada test site, the afternoon,

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the… that just walk
across those bare ground.

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My particular job was to

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give a quickie ecologically valuation
of the affects of the explosion.

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And in 1957, they were
having about one a week.

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[music]

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The most dramatic thing
about the explosion to me

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was the great variety of colors that I saw

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and the great amount of twisting
and turning and just shier motion

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in the explosion.

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It seems like it goes on for
a long time but you know

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it’s just a fraction of a second.
In… in one shot,

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I can remember the Steel Tower,
the bottom part of it glowed

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like a filament in a lamp, for instance,

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and then disappeared. The… the next thing

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that you noticed that was
a kind of a surge at…

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at the base of the tower and then you could…
even in dim light, you could see the blast waves

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move across the valley floor
and you can watch that

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blast wave moves toward you and you can
turn and… and then you can feel it,

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and after all this, finally what seems
a long time, you can hear the boom!

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[sil.]

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No one can explain to you what an atomic
explosion and looks like until you see it.

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It’s an awesome thing.

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I’m sure the people that
exploded first run it in Mexico,

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must have had the same feeling.
What do we do know?

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[sil.]

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Well, I think everybody was
very thrilled about, you know.

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We thought it was great stuff. Probably
because we built the bomb here,

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you know, so when the bomb dropped,
it became fairly apparent.

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Immediately, that it was
gonna end the war, you know.

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I don’t think anybody fully realized
until probably into the ‘50s,

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what… what we’ve done… what… what we’ve
brought onto the earth, you know,

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and that’s for sure, we do
in the air, fully realized.

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[sil.]

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Hanford was a result of World War II.

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Uh… The notion that we need to… needed
to be build bigger better weapons

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that were more effective,
and Hanford is a place

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where they irradiated the uranium and processed
it so that they can get the plutonium,

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plain as sample. It’s a plutonium processing
facility and it made the raw material for the bomb,

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uh… it was a huge process,
it was a dirty process

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but it ended up with enough material
to put into to 50 to 60,000

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nuclear weapons in the US
Arsenal and it is close now.

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It’s now an environmental remediation
stage, we don’t need the plutonium anymore.

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Hanford is half the size of
the state of Rhode Island

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and the Columbia River flows through Hanford for 50
miles, which is an immense amount of natural shoreline.

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And along those 50 miles, we
have nine large full-scale

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nuclear reactors for
production of plutonium.

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Those reactors dumped there liquid
waste straight into the river,

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except for the last one the n-reactor
which dumped its liquid waste into

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half-mile long ditches along the river.

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As you go inland, we have

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two large areas that are
several square miles

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that were used for the largest industrial
facilities built ever at the time,

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to extract plutonium from the fuel rods,

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and essentially they took the fuel rods out of the
reactors and melted them down in nitric acid.

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I mean, (inaudible) were tiny
little tiny pieces of plutonium,

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you know, this microscopic in size for a ton of
fuel and so you had a tremendous waste stream

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associated with plutonium production
especially when you consider that

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they created 70 metric tons of
plutonium at Hanford or so.

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And then they said, \"Well, what do we do with the
nitric acid mixed with all this radioactive guck?\"

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And they said, \"Well, let’s build a tank,\"

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and then they built another tank and then they ran out
of space in the tanks and they simply discharged,

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a million gallons of liquid high-level
nuclear waste straight into the soil.

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Other wastes, they said, \"Well, maybe
we should put this in the soil,\"

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so they dug injection wells and
pumped it straight into the ground.

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Umm… Then they eventually built 177 of these
massive high-level nuclear waste tanks,

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many of which are the size of a
four story apartment building

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covering an entire block, a
billion gallons per tank.

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So now what you’ve got is there’s
nothing like it on the planet really,

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it’s… it’s highly complicated,

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umm… huge amount of chemically, radioactively
contaminated material and they estimated,

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there’s about 53 million gallons of
waste currently stored in these tanks,

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umm… that’s about two-thirds
of the National Inventory

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of high level nuclear waste.
There was a tremendous

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amount of releases material down there.
What’s they denied up until 1986,

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when 19,000 reclassified documents

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had to be released to the freedom of information act, they
didn’t know what to do with his waste which is very dangerous.

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Much of it was dumped in the pits,

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uh… pits dug down there and sooner
they’ll go away but till this day,

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they don’t know where some of these pits are down
there. Uh… They’re still in the mode of discovery

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down here as to what’s there.

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The third of these tanks have leaked about a
million gallons into the soil beneath the tanks

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that contamination is hitting the groundwater. That ground
water communicates with this river. From the river,

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it goes into bio-systems, so that’s what
we’re all trying to prevent from happening,

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we don’t want any of that tank waste to
hit our environment now or in the future.

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Although it looks like it’s
in big trouble right now.

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I don’t know, what in the world
is gonna happen with that place.

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I can’t imagine all that
acreage of square miles

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of land just sitting

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from now to eternity.

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There’s nothing out there,
sage, brush and cheat grass,

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and a fuel concrete hoax(ph)
of reactors, that’s all.

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Used to have trees along the
street, green, you know,

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and buildings, now there’s nothing, but you can still
see a little bit of sidewalk where the street was.

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There have been people

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who would have asked me how I felt
about the whole thing, you know,

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am I better?

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And I say no, I guess I’m not bitter

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but I’m disappointed.

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I’m disappointed that the government would
do what they did the way they did it

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to the people and then have never

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recognized the sacrifice
that they made when they…

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when they sold out to… The
Indian should be just as…

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just as much recognized as we are

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in reference to being moved out

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because they lost their fishing
grounds there, and then they ended up

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and really gave it them (inaudible)
when they built Priest Rapids dam,

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they flooded their village up there.

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[music]

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[music]

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We spend a lot of time
trying to read landscapes.

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We got in a car today or
(inaudible) with Bob and I.

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The whole thing is a conversation about

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what’s going on here (inaudible)
and why is this here

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and where did it come from and what… what forms
have these people put on this landscape.

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One of the things that geography
has totally focused on,

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are the sequent occupants
of… You have this landscape

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and you start down there in the Tri Cities and you’ve got
native cultures on that river for thousands of years

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then you instantly start going
through these phases of

00:25:00.000 --> 00:25:04.999
explorers and fur trappers and missionaries

00:25:05.000 --> 00:25:09.999
and you get rail systems coming
in supporting mining industries

00:25:10.000 --> 00:25:14.999
and early agricultural growth in those
areas and so the geography gets rewritten.

00:25:15.000 --> 00:25:19.999
You get almost a layering
of new system of settlement

00:25:20.000 --> 00:25:24.999
and dynamics of environmental modification

00:25:25.000 --> 00:25:29.999
upon the old one and it’s
almost like a layer cake

00:25:30.000 --> 00:25:34.999
that you can read each sequential modification
system. And… and the new ones don’t really wipe out

00:25:35.000 --> 00:25:39.999
the old ones totally. So there’s
underwritten little vestiges

00:25:40.000 --> 00:25:44.999
and what once was and… and go down back through time
and you can see the different layers like that.

00:25:45.000 --> 00:25:49.999
You know, first you had
Native American communities

00:25:50.000 --> 00:25:54.999
and the way that they ordered and
regulated manage their landscape

00:25:55.000 --> 00:25:59.999
and their Salmon(ph) economy
and then you had small-scale

00:26:00.000 --> 00:26:04.999
pioneer farming essentially,

00:26:05.000 --> 00:26:09.999
and that was sort of transformed by

00:26:10.000 --> 00:26:14.999
the beginning of large-scale
federal irrigation projects,

00:26:15.000 --> 00:26:19.999
right and you have the beginnings of that
in 1902, with the new ones reclamation act.

00:26:20.000 --> 00:26:24.999
Reclamation in the 19th
century was a term that

00:26:25.000 --> 00:26:29.999
would have been used by a preacher,
not a federal bureaucrat,

00:26:30.000 --> 00:26:34.999
right, you reclaim souls
from darkness, right.

00:26:35.000 --> 00:26:39.999
You bring them back to life
and wilderness around here,

00:26:40.000 --> 00:26:44.999
and the reality of wilderness here in the desert landscape
and that kind of stark arid hostile desert landscape

00:26:45.000 --> 00:26:49.999
is more like that kind
of biblical wilderness

00:26:50.000 --> 00:26:54.999
then it is like a modern
environmentalist paradise wilderness.

00:26:55.000 --> 00:26:59.999
And in the 20th century, federal planners,

00:27:00.000 --> 00:27:04.999
there’s kind of a parallel there because
what… how do you reclaim nature?

00:27:05.000 --> 00:27:09.999
How do you reclaim forsaken wilderness?
Right. God forsaken wilderness.

00:27:10.000 --> 00:27:14.999
You baptized it with water from the river and
you make it once again into a Garden of Eden.

00:27:15.000 --> 00:27:23.000
[music]

00:27:40.000 --> 00:27:44.999
I think the first Dam on
the Columbia was probably

00:27:45.000 --> 00:27:49.999
in 1933 at Rocky… Rock
Island, then Bonneville,

00:27:50.000 --> 00:27:54.999
then Grand Coulee and then a whole
slew of dams after the war.

00:27:55.000 --> 00:27:59.999
Back in the ‘50s, I was in the military

00:28:00.000 --> 00:28:04.999
and stationed at camp
Hanford in to diamond,

00:28:05.000 --> 00:28:09.999
a road across the Hanford very
several times going to the…

00:28:10.000 --> 00:28:14.999
There were gunning placements out
on the north side of the river.

00:28:15.000 --> 00:28:19.999
I was in the area before they
build a Priest Rapids Dam.

00:28:20.000 --> 00:28:24.999
My brother-in-law worked on Priest Rapids
dam and he worked on the Wanapum dam both,

00:28:25.000 --> 00:28:29.999
and this was all free flowing
river, then it was wild river,

00:28:30.000 --> 00:28:34.999
then it free-flowing and this is natural.
There was time,

00:28:35.000 --> 00:28:39.999
the water down enough to where these
(inaudible) down here was pretty shallow

00:28:40.000 --> 00:28:44.999
unless you got right
through the middle of it.

00:28:45.000 --> 00:28:49.999
Basically I live on the boat, I fished
commercial for 35 years on the ocean

00:28:50.000 --> 00:28:54.999
and I sleep better out on the water than
they do at home in my bed in the bedroom,

00:28:55.000 --> 00:28:59.999
and you know, if the conditions are right, I’ll
fish at night. Then a few hours in the morning

00:29:00.000 --> 00:29:04.999
and then sleep during the day time.
If I’m not catching fish,

00:29:05.000 --> 00:29:09.999
I’m tying up gear or tying up more
hooks and drinking (inaudible),

00:29:10.000 --> 00:29:14.999
smoking cigarettes and trying to think
of what to do to catch a fish, you know.

00:29:15.000 --> 00:29:19.999
The big story in this area, of
course is the Fall Chinook,

00:29:20.000 --> 00:29:24.999
and… and the Hanford Reach itself
maintains the largest run of Fall Chinook

00:29:25.000 --> 00:29:29.999
that remains in the world as far
as natural fish. This time a year,

00:29:30.000 --> 00:29:34.999
Fall Chinook are entering in
the Lower Columbia River.

00:29:35.000 --> 00:29:39.999
They’re in the realm of 100,000
fish, adult fish enter the river

00:29:40.000 --> 00:29:44.999
that take couple of weeks to come up, they returned to their
natal streams, so as adults they’re gonna come up and lay eggs.

00:29:45.000 --> 00:29:49.999
The fish lay their eggs in
the fall, they incubate

00:29:50.000 --> 00:29:54.999
through the winter, they
patch in the spring

00:29:55.000 --> 00:29:59.999
and then they migrate out to the ocean and they take
anywhere from two to five months to hit the ocean,

00:30:00.000 --> 00:30:04.999
and then they start that whole cycle again. Oh, just
got here try to catch these northern pike minnows,

00:30:05.000 --> 00:30:09.999
they call them… the Indians
still call them squawfish,

00:30:10.000 --> 00:30:14.999
try to make a couple of dollars, make
enough money to pay our expenses

00:30:15.000 --> 00:30:19.999
at least while we do our sport
fishing, fish started out $4

00:30:20.000 --> 00:30:24.999
for the first 100 and $5 for
the next 300 and $8 pays

00:30:25.000 --> 00:30:29.999
for everything over 400 fish.

00:30:30.000 --> 00:30:34.999
The program is, you know, basically
to not to eliminate the squawfish,

00:30:35.000 --> 00:30:39.999
you just kinda control them a little bit
so they don’t eat so many smoked smolts.

00:30:40.000 --> 00:30:44.999
It helps in two ways, it keeps them from
eating so much of the spawners’ examiner,

00:30:45.000 --> 00:30:49.999
trying to put the eggs in the reeds and also keeps
it from eating the smolts when the eggs hatch out.

00:30:50.000 --> 00:30:54.999
I don’t know why they call it the wild,

00:30:55.000 --> 00:30:59.999
especially the Columbia because there’s nothing
wild about it, where these river running,

00:31:00.000 --> 00:31:04.999
you know, where they running the dams now.
Last year and this year,

00:31:05.000 --> 00:31:09.999
this portion… the upper proportions of Columbia has
been really, really tough for fishing these squawfish

00:31:10.000 --> 00:31:14.999
because the water comes up into
trees every night or every day

00:31:15.000 --> 00:31:19.999
and the up and down like a yo-yo and the fish
come up and feed in the grass and the trees

00:31:20.000 --> 00:31:24.999
and so for the next morning that, you
know, they just don’t wanna bite.

00:31:25.000 --> 00:31:29.999
We really enjoy, umm… people when they start
to talk about natural resource management.

00:31:30.000 --> 00:31:34.999
Those natural patterns
have largely been removed

00:31:35.000 --> 00:31:39.999
from some of the most important arteries around the
rivers. They do not function like normal rivers anymore.

00:31:40.000 --> 00:31:44.999
They are large reservoirs operated for hydro-power
so that when people in Portland need power,

00:31:45.000 --> 00:31:49.999
the river goes up. I mean
I was on the Columbia

00:31:50.000 --> 00:31:54.999
the other night fishing and
the river came up two feet,

00:31:55.000 --> 00:31:59.999
when Portland (inaudible) got home from
work and the pickup truck got flooded,

00:32:00.000 --> 00:32:04.999
sitting on the back, now that just doesn’t happen in a natural
world. In middle of July, the river comes up two feet

00:32:05.000 --> 00:32:09.999
and then goes down two hours later, this
kind of fluctuation has changed the banks,

00:32:10.000 --> 00:32:14.999
exchanged the (inaudible) systems,
fish systems. Umm… It’s… it’s messing.

00:32:15.000 --> 00:32:19.999
[sil.]

00:32:20.000 --> 00:32:24.999
This is a Little (inaudible) Goose dam,

00:32:25.000 --> 00:32:29.999
and it’s got currently six
generators on tap for

00:32:30.000 --> 00:32:34.999
power production to its customers,

00:32:35.000 --> 00:32:39.999
and also a good fish (inaudible) facility.
It’s an important

00:32:40.000 --> 00:32:44.999
key element in the natural
system that man has made here.

00:32:45.000 --> 00:32:49.999
[sil.]

00:32:50.000 --> 00:32:54.999
This operation Little Goose dam actually
came into existence in the 1974,

00:32:55.000 --> 00:32:59.999
we are here to allow for transportation of
fish, or migration of fish through this dam.

00:33:00.000 --> 00:33:04.999
Fish that are migrating upstream will go through
our adult waters and fish coming downstream

00:33:05.000 --> 00:33:09.999
are collected above the dam and go through dam and come to our
collection facility right here when we do this operation here.

00:33:10.000 --> 00:33:14.999
This year is one of our peak years.

00:33:15.000 --> 00:33:19.999
Uh… we have transported today
close about six million fish,

00:33:20.000 --> 00:33:24.999
and these are smolts ranging size
from about 32 millimeters up

00:33:25.000 --> 00:33:29.999
to about to about 150 to 200 milliliters
long. Primarily salmon and steel here.

00:33:30.000 --> 00:33:38.000
[sil.]

00:33:45.000 --> 00:33:49.999
You can see our truck,

00:33:50.000 --> 00:33:54.999
it will leave Little Goose dam
here today, and this afternoon

00:33:55.000 --> 00:33:59.999
it will arrive in (inaudible) Oregon. And then
approximately at two to three o’clock this afternoon,

00:34:00.000 --> 00:34:04.999
we’ll get onto the barge and
then go out to (inaudible) side.

00:34:05.000 --> 00:34:09.999
There… (inaudible) river. This
transportation allows the fish to go through

00:34:10.000 --> 00:34:14.999
the river at about same time the smolt
would be going downstream at same time.

00:34:15.000 --> 00:34:19.999
The pools will slow down the migration
of fish that we have… have here,

00:34:20.000 --> 00:34:24.999
those man made pools. Naturally the
fish would be doing their own thing,

00:34:25.000 --> 00:34:29.999
I mean, there will be pools, there would be
(inaudible) that speed up the process down the stream

00:34:30.000 --> 00:34:34.999
or slow it down at the same time. This system’s,
transportation system because you use the barging,

00:34:35.000 --> 00:34:39.999
(inaudible) the fish allows more natural
type migration fish down to the ocean.

00:34:40.000 --> 00:34:44.999
That’s what we’re doing, we’re
(inaudible) nature’s response to system.

00:34:45.000 --> 00:34:49.999
When you’re (inaudible) here a little
bit and then we’re trapping them

00:34:50.000 --> 00:34:54.999
(inaudible), it’s a natural
progression things here.

00:34:55.000 --> 00:34:59.999
I mean, in general, I don’t subscribe nor
do I like to see barging of the fish

00:35:00.000 --> 00:35:04.999
because I think it’s not natural. That’s
what this dam breaching is all about.

00:35:05.000 --> 00:35:09.999
Yeah, so I would like to see the… the Yakama river or uh…
First, I would like to see the Snake River natural again.

00:35:10.000 --> 00:35:14.999
I’d love to take a canoe
down there in the rapids.

00:35:15.000 --> 00:35:19.999
Umm… I’d like to see the
Columbia River natural,

00:35:20.000 --> 00:35:24.999
but I don’t have necessarily subscribe to take the dams down, we need
water here. This is an arid environment, without our ability to engineer,

00:35:25.000 --> 00:35:29.999
drill, convey, irrigate,

00:35:30.000 --> 00:35:34.999
develop… we… we wouldn’t have anybody
here, so you have to have compromise.

00:35:35.000 --> 00:35:39.999
I think when it comes to getting
back to the historic conditions,

00:35:40.000 --> 00:35:44.999
umm… again we’d all love to
have it but it’s not reality,

00:35:45.000 --> 00:35:49.999
I don’t think… I don’t think it’s practical. Will
the dams ever get removed in the next 45 years?

00:35:50.000 --> 00:35:54.999
I… I… who know. There’s…
there’s always a (inaudible).

00:35:55.000 --> 00:35:59.999
I think the biggest
problem with the dams is…

00:36:00.000 --> 00:36:04.999
is there up and down and then…
when they smolts this up

00:36:05.000 --> 00:36:09.999
and the smolts go back into the…

00:36:10.000 --> 00:36:14.999
They’re not ready to migrate down yet they’ll go
back into the grass and the water goes back down

00:36:15.000 --> 00:36:19.999
and there’s a pool there, they’re trapped
in that pool, that water seeps out

00:36:20.000 --> 00:36:24.999
that pool before it comes
back up again they’re dead.

00:36:25.000 --> 00:36:29.999
Millions of them every year and I don’t know,
who are all screaming there, raise the water,

00:36:30.000 --> 00:36:34.999
run more water down, but when they do, they’re killing more
smolts, trapping them in these ponds and what, get killed.

00:36:35.000 --> 00:36:39.999
Killed going through the turbines.

00:36:40.000 --> 00:36:44.999
But you take these people, you know, they got a lot of money and
nothing to do except stick your nose in other people’s business

00:36:45.000 --> 00:36:49.999
and don’t understand what they’re talking about,
get these lawsuits going or stuff like that.

00:36:50.000 --> 00:36:54.999
They’re doing more harm than they are good.
Somebody, more highly educated people

00:36:55.000 --> 00:36:59.999
are literally stupid, that’s all there is
to it, you know, they’re… they’re… educated

00:37:00.000 --> 00:37:04.999
but they’re stupid, they don’t
understand what’s going on.

00:37:05.000 --> 00:37:09.999
They’re too smart to think about it.

00:37:10.000 --> 00:37:14.999
And again all I’m saying that we
should quit running the river up

00:37:15.000 --> 00:37:19.999
and down like a, yo-yo, so I get out
there and catch more squawfish.

00:37:20.000 --> 00:37:24.999
[sil.]

00:37:25.000 --> 00:37:29.999
Umm… I think when you live here,

00:37:30.000 --> 00:37:34.999
umm… you have to umm… give the river

00:37:35.000 --> 00:37:39.999
some credit for surviving.

00:37:40.000 --> 00:37:44.999
You have to give nature some credit for being
so resilient and you do have to recognize

00:37:45.000 --> 00:37:49.999
that nature exists in all
kinds of environments.

00:37:50.000 --> 00:37:54.999
I’m looking at the Columbia River
right now and I see the island,

00:37:55.000 --> 00:37:59.999
I see pelicans, I see deer. I see salmon.
Nature’s still there.

00:38:00.000 --> 00:38:04.999
I don’t know if there are
unnatural environments,

00:38:05.000 --> 00:38:09.999
we just modify the environment
here, we’d like the river,

00:38:10.000 --> 00:38:14.999
it’s uh… it’s not like it was, but
I… but it was a lot different,

00:38:15.000 --> 00:38:19.999
13,000 years ago when the
water was 500 feet deep,

00:38:20.000 --> 00:38:24.999
where we’re sitting right
now, so I don’t know

00:38:25.000 --> 00:38:29.999
if that’s an unnatural change or not,
earthquakes are natural. People are natural.

00:38:30.000 --> 00:38:35.000
Whatever you do is natural, I
guess even plutonium is natural.

00:38:50.000 --> 00:38:54.999
The Hanford site, even
though it was… basically

00:38:55.000 --> 00:38:59.999
they talked about condemning the land and
setting it aside for nuclear production.

00:39:00.000 --> 00:39:04.999
The fact that it’s been protected
or… or restricted access

00:39:05.000 --> 00:39:09.999
for the last 50 years has really allowed
us to maintain a remnant of shrubs step

00:39:10.000 --> 00:39:14.999
habitat here in Washington, that
otherwise wouldn’t be available,

00:39:15.000 --> 00:39:19.999
so even though we have
large production areas

00:39:20.000 --> 00:39:24.999
and wastes associated
with nuclear production

00:39:25.000 --> 00:39:29.999
we also have one of the most diverse
and rich shrub step ecosystems

00:39:30.000 --> 00:39:34.999
that are left in the… in the
lower part of this state.

00:39:35.000 --> 00:39:39.999
That landscape of irony really struck me, one time
when I… I had to survey a power line from the,

00:39:40.000 --> 00:39:44.999
how about the (inaudible)
test reactor to Portland

00:39:45.000 --> 00:39:49.999
and I had been out it walked on this thing.
And the first thing I noticed is

00:39:50.000 --> 00:39:54.999
this might be the first time I was ever in shrub step vegetation
and it looks like it’s supposed to out of the textbook

00:39:55.000 --> 00:39:59.999
and I realized that by
being internal to Hanford

00:40:00.000 --> 00:40:04.999
and being protected from
keeping people out,

00:40:05.000 --> 00:40:09.999
they had actually created pockets of vegetation that were
healthy. I mean, this blew me away. I… You know, I thought,

00:40:10.000 --> 00:40:14.999
\"My god!\" So I started to say
things, \"Well, thank god!

00:40:15.000 --> 00:40:19.999
It’s a nuclear reactor,\" we wouldn’t even know
what a shrub step vegetation ought to look like.

00:40:20.000 --> 00:40:24.999
They’re over plant species
known from the Hanford site,

00:40:25.000 --> 00:40:29.999
we have large (inaudible)
like elk, mule, deer.

00:40:30.000 --> 00:40:34.999
Certainly our predators, coyotes,
badgers are across the site,

00:40:35.000 --> 00:40:39.999
small mammals, lizards.

00:40:40.000 --> 00:40:44.999
We have a system that once covered

00:40:45.000 --> 00:40:49.999
millions and millions of acres

00:40:50.000 --> 00:40:54.999
this shrub step ecosystem that is reduced to
fairly small blocks of land. Unfortunately,

00:40:55.000 --> 00:40:59.999
because of the encroachment of
urbanization and development

00:41:00.000 --> 00:41:04.999
and agriculture on the shrubs steppe
lands, a number of sage brush,

00:41:05.000 --> 00:41:09.999
obligate species are now
on state lists in most

00:41:10.000 --> 00:41:14.999
of the West as being concerned. There’s
no national park in sage brush,

00:41:15.000 --> 00:41:19.999
national parks for the most part
weren’t set aside for (inaudible).

00:41:20.000 --> 00:41:24.999
They were set aside because they
were nice to look at, mountains,

00:41:25.000 --> 00:41:29.999
geysers, rivers and what… whatnot.
And there’s no place

00:41:30.000 --> 00:41:34.999
in the shrub step that was ever considered
to be set aside. And then you have something

00:41:35.000 --> 00:41:39.999
like the Hanford monument, right,
and here it is sitting out there.

00:41:40.000 --> 00:41:44.999
This is the most unnatural piece the water
you can find. Here’s a piece of river

00:41:45.000 --> 00:41:49.999
that’s got nuclear facilities built around it,
it’s got (inaudible) runoff and it’s got chemicals

00:41:50.000 --> 00:41:54.999
from Canadian lines flowing past it.
It’s just got all kinds of crap in it,

00:41:55.000 --> 00:41:59.999
in the land near it and on the banks and it
fluctuates as we turn electricity off and on,

00:42:00.000 --> 00:42:04.999
and we make it a national monument.
Beautiful!

00:42:05.000 --> 00:42:09.999
I think war was… was an accident

00:42:10.000 --> 00:42:14.999
that it wouldn’t have been
here except for circumstances

00:42:15.000 --> 00:42:19.999
that are centered around the
production of plutonium.

00:42:20.000 --> 00:42:28.000
[music]

00:42:50.000 --> 00:42:54.999
I don’t know… I don’t know why people,

00:42:55.000 --> 00:42:59.999
you know, like to move to deserts and
then turn them into the proverbial oasis.

00:43:00.000 --> 00:43:04.999
It’s kinda like if you want to live
in the desert then live in a desert.

00:43:05.000 --> 00:43:09.999
There’s nothing wrong with it.

00:43:10.000 --> 00:43:14.999
It’s really easy to plow sage brush
down, now (inaudible) sage brush.

00:43:15.000 --> 00:43:19.999
People kind of think of sage brushes
expendable like and, you know,

00:43:20.000 --> 00:43:24.999
don’t really want to protect it like they
might big (inaudible), a big oak tree,

00:43:25.000 --> 00:43:29.999
or a big maple, and this is our… this is our
old growth. This is a nice look and sage brush

00:43:30.000 --> 00:43:34.999
and if it was plowed down,
you know, it could be 40…

00:43:35.000 --> 00:43:39.999
it could be 100 years before we
ever get anything that big again.

00:43:40.000 --> 00:43:44.999
This different mosses are called cryptogams

00:43:45.000 --> 00:43:49.999
and they hold the soil down. When people
in this area complained about the dust,

00:43:50.000 --> 00:43:54.999
what they should be complaining about
is everybody tearing up fresh ground,

00:43:55.000 --> 00:43:59.999
because when you tear up the ground,
you let the dust (inaudible),

00:44:00.000 --> 00:44:04.999
even like old-timers will say, \"Well, it
always blue here, there was always dust,\"

00:44:05.000 --> 00:44:09.999
and… and if you look at the pictures of the Manhattan Project, well, of course,
there was dust. They came in and they leveled out, I don’t know how many acres

00:44:10.000 --> 00:44:14.999
just to build the city to… to… to support the
Hanford works, Hanford engineering works

00:44:15.000 --> 00:44:19.999
and so there wasn’t a stitch of ground
cover, so of course, it was dusty.

00:44:20.000 --> 00:44:24.999
I guarantee you, you could be having 70 mile an hour
winds and there’s not gonna be anything blowing off

00:44:25.000 --> 00:44:29.999
of this except maybe the grass seeds but
certainly no dust. This thick dense,

00:44:30.000 --> 00:44:34.999
really well established moss. I don’t know,

00:44:35.000 --> 00:44:39.999
I think most people would
think this is pretty in here

00:44:40.000 --> 00:44:44.999
but if they never get exposed to it how
can they have an appreciation for it.

00:44:45.000 --> 00:44:49.999
Well, firstly, I never thought
it was very beautiful

00:44:50.000 --> 00:44:54.999
but I’m colorblind. I don’t
have the artistic appreciation,

00:44:55.000 --> 00:44:59.999
a lot of people do. In fact, I
always thought of the sage brush

00:45:00.000 --> 00:45:04.999
as… that the sage brush region is
the gray zone. Everything is gray.

00:45:05.000 --> 00:45:09.999
The soil is gray. The plants are gray

00:45:10.000 --> 00:45:14.999
and when I came to Hanford
to buildings were gray,

00:45:15.000 --> 00:45:19.999
the reactors were grey and
even painted the cars gray,

00:45:20.000 --> 00:45:24.999
so but the flowers…

00:45:25.000 --> 00:45:29.999
the flowering forbs are beautiful
for short time in spring.

00:45:30.000 --> 00:45:34.999
Roosevelt would have never
believed that this area was

00:45:35.000 --> 00:45:39.999
intrinsically valuable enough as
a wilderness area to preserve,

00:45:40.000 --> 00:45:44.999
shrubs step, who wants to preserve shrubs
step, what would that have meant to… to… to…

00:45:45.000 --> 00:45:49.999
Roosevelt, and I think he would have just
cocked his head and looked at you and,

00:45:50.000 --> 00:45:54.999
you know, as if you were crazy
suggesting that, you know,

00:45:55.000 --> 00:45:59.999
this should be preserved because it has intrinsic
value. I think Roosevelt would have said,

00:46:00.000 --> 00:46:04.999
umm… this should be developed, bring…
bring water to the land, build…

00:46:05.000 --> 00:46:09.999
build the dams and make it into
a landscape of family farms.

00:46:10.000 --> 00:46:14.999
[sil.]

00:46:15.000 --> 00:46:19.999
Uh… This… this piece ground we’re currently on, my family
did not bring it out of sage brush but place where

00:46:20.000 --> 00:46:24.999
my mom and dad live, when they moved here
there was absolutely nothing but sage brush,

00:46:25.000 --> 00:46:29.999
jack rabbits inhabiting the land.
My grandma used to say, she can’t…

00:46:30.000 --> 00:46:34.999
she can never figure out why they took
this land from the Indians, you know,

00:46:35.000 --> 00:46:39.999
because when my grandma moved here,
you know, dust storms were prevalent.

00:46:40.000 --> 00:46:44.999
There was no… there was no paved road, if you were to tell somebody to
pack and (inaudible) take the stuff and they can get in their suburban car

00:46:45.000 --> 00:46:49.999
and headed cross-country and
starting a completely new life.

00:46:50.000 --> 00:46:54.999
Most people wouldn’t be able to handle it and,
you know, every family that’s currently here,

00:46:55.000 --> 00:46:59.999
their grandparents or parents or somebody
was here and did that exact thing,

00:47:00.000 --> 00:47:04.999
you know, that exact transformation,
50 years ago was pretty neat that it…

00:47:05.000 --> 00:47:09.999
I guess I’m still consider
myself in the grass roots

00:47:10.000 --> 00:47:14.999
of… yeah, of the system.

00:47:15.000 --> 00:47:19.999
The reason my family is here as both of my
grandparents came out for the Manhattan project.

00:47:20.000 --> 00:47:24.999
Both sets and they found
enough reason to stay

00:47:25.000 --> 00:47:29.999
that most of the family has moved here
and most of the children born here

00:47:30.000 --> 00:47:34.999
and there’s not a strong reason to leave,

00:47:35.000 --> 00:47:39.999
umm… we try not to talk about Hanford,
and I’m making in the same sentence.

00:47:40.000 --> 00:47:44.999
This vineyard was the first plot

00:47:45.000 --> 00:47:49.999
of grapes planted out here on Red Mountain.
I think my dad

00:47:50.000 --> 00:47:54.999
and his original partner, when they
started planting this vineyard,

00:47:55.000 --> 00:47:59.999
it all looked like this, there was
absolutely no road, there was no power,

00:48:00.000 --> 00:48:04.999
there was no water. It actually took us about
three years to get a well dug and power out here.

00:48:05.000 --> 00:48:09.999
My dad and his partner used to
tell people, we… we got together,

00:48:10.000 --> 00:48:14.999
we pulled our money and we threw it in a hole
in the ground and that really is what they did.

00:48:15.000 --> 00:48:19.999
We have to irrigate, there’s just no way
around it, and in some parts of the world,

00:48:20.000 --> 00:48:24.999
it’s illegal to irrigate, you have to leave it to
mother nature to give you the right amount of rain

00:48:25.000 --> 00:48:29.999
at the right time to get the crop
ripe in order to make great wine.

00:48:30.000 --> 00:48:34.999
Well, in this climate, as you can see. If
you don’t water it, it isn’t going to grow.

00:48:35.000 --> 00:48:39.999
The average rainfall here as
less than six inches a year

00:48:40.000 --> 00:48:44.999
but that is also key to why we can grow
some of the best grapes in the world.

00:48:45.000 --> 00:48:53.000
[music]

00:49:00.000 --> 00:49:04.999
Rain from above is not what we want, water on the ground is
what we do, so this whole area survives on water on the ground,

00:49:05.000 --> 00:49:09.999
not from the air so, we don’t need
rain in this area, we need this…

00:49:10.000 --> 00:49:14.999
we need the heat, we need the sun and all that,
so irrigation is totally different than rain.

00:49:15.000 --> 00:49:19.999
Like this year, we’re fighting with water, we’re trying to keep
enough water umm… since it’s the drought as if last night,

00:49:20.000 --> 00:49:24.999
we only had half our water so
trying to keep the trees wet

00:49:25.000 --> 00:49:29.999
because now this is the time where they set their buds for
next year. And the one week, that we had (inaudible) whether,

00:49:30.000 --> 00:49:34.999
you know, I tried to get water on and there
just wasn’t there and even my field (inaudible)

00:49:35.000 --> 00:49:39.999
that we can need it because the cherries will take in the water and
sometimes it gets some size off of them and we just didn’t have it.

00:49:40.000 --> 00:49:44.999
Our irrigation company gets it from another
company and so there’s a battle right there,

00:49:45.000 --> 00:49:49.999
they get 80% during the drought, we’re
getting 50, so it’s been a battle for them,

00:49:50.000 --> 00:49:54.999
they’ve been having to place it, they’ve been having to monitor it, they’ve been having to
regulated it, they’ve been having to a whole bunch of other stuff to that water up there.

00:49:55.000 --> 00:49:59.999
[sil.]

00:50:00.000 --> 00:50:04.999
There’s gold, I mean, people get
in wars, guys packing guns,

00:50:05.000 --> 00:50:09.999
you know, fighting for water rights
because that’s just… it is your life.

00:50:10.000 --> 00:50:14.999
So people get pitted against
each other over one resource

00:50:15.000 --> 00:50:19.999
and it’s water, and that
drive wedges between people.

00:50:20.000 --> 00:50:24.999
So these are landscapes of conflict in many ways. They
are in many ways invariably landscapes of conflict.

00:50:25.000 --> 00:50:29.999
Especially when you take a primary resource
like that river or the Columbia for hydro-power

00:50:30.000 --> 00:50:34.999
and you assign its ownership and
management to one group of people

00:50:35.000 --> 00:50:39.999
and then they sit there and do that for a few years,
but suddenly the world round and reorganizes,

00:50:40.000 --> 00:50:44.999
and other priorities emerge. I
mean, Timothy(ph) hay to Japan

00:50:45.000 --> 00:50:49.999
using irrigation water from
a river that goes dry.

00:50:50.000 --> 00:50:54.999
It’s very hard for a recreational person to
understand, they don’t see the economic connection,

00:50:55.000 --> 00:50:59.999
they don’t see the tradition, they clearly,
probably don’t know the hay farmer.

00:51:00.000 --> 00:51:04.999
I would like to think that
American people would realize

00:51:05.000 --> 00:51:09.999
that the situation we’ve got
ourselves into now with the oil,

00:51:10.000 --> 00:51:14.999
I mean, completely… almost completely
dependent on foreign countries for fuel.

00:51:15.000 --> 00:51:19.999
I would think that they would realize that that wouldn’t be
the best road to go down when it comes to food production.

00:51:20.000 --> 00:51:24.999
You’re not gonna be able to just restart
food production in the United States

00:51:25.000 --> 00:51:29.999
after you ran every farmer out of business and
the equipment dealers are gone and the mechanics

00:51:30.000 --> 00:51:34.999
would fix the equipment and moved on to other jobs.
It’s not something that you can turn off the switch

00:51:35.000 --> 00:51:39.999
one day and four years later, go
back and turn the switch back on.

00:51:40.000 --> 00:51:44.999
If the dams were removed, uh…
agriculture in central Washington

00:51:45.000 --> 00:51:49.999
would basically cease to exist.
This whole area would dry up

00:51:50.000 --> 00:51:54.999
and everyone would move away.

00:51:55.000 --> 00:51:59.999
Anybody with the right mind, the dams
have to stay. I mean, that’s our power,

00:52:00.000 --> 00:52:04.999
that’s what a lot of California gets
them of their power from us as well.

00:52:05.000 --> 00:52:09.999
It’s (inaudible) that they could take it out, people want
take them out, they want the land go back to normal.

00:52:10.000 --> 00:52:14.999
They stop using your cell phones and cars and your electricity home and then you
can take out the dams and go back to the old ways because it’s just not possible.

00:52:15.000 --> 00:52:23.000
[music]

00:52:55.000 --> 00:52:59.999
Now this landscapes full of mistakes.

00:53:00.000 --> 00:53:04.999
Lots of them and we repeat them often.

00:53:05.000 --> 00:53:09.999
There are countless irrigation
ditches that people tried to build

00:53:10.000 --> 00:53:14.999
and water didn’t flow up hay land farm,
they didn’t know how to measure it,

00:53:15.000 --> 00:53:19.999
just disaster after disaster out here. A clear-cutting
legacy in the mountains that altered stream flow

00:53:20.000 --> 00:53:24.999
and introduced sediments, umm… the building
of dams without adequate fish passage,

00:53:25.000 --> 00:53:29.999
irrigating land that had no
business being irrigated.

00:53:30.000 --> 00:53:34.999
Umm… Having irrigated systems we’ve set up, they
don’t even produce enough income to pay the debts.

00:53:35.000 --> 00:53:39.999
I mean, it’s… it’s a landscape that
of… of really incredible mistakes

00:53:40.000 --> 00:53:44.999
if you thought the world should run
efficiently. It doesn’t… It’s not efficient.

00:53:45.000 --> 00:53:49.999
It is human beings doing things and they are not connected,
and they’re often at cross purposes to each other.

00:53:50.000 --> 00:53:54.999
We’ve created a new landscape,
kind of hybrid landscapes,

00:53:55.000 --> 00:53:59.999
umm… which reflects the desires
of various groups of humans

00:54:00.000 --> 00:54:04.999
along the way to exploit
this environment in…

00:54:05.000 --> 00:54:09.999
indistinctive kinds of ways
and so now you see the legacy

00:54:10.000 --> 00:54:14.999
of Hanford, you see the legacy of the dams

00:54:15.000 --> 00:54:19.999
and irrigated agriculture and you
see the legacy of Native Americans

00:54:20.000 --> 00:54:24.999
with the Native American fishing
sites and fishing rights.

00:54:25.000 --> 00:54:29.999
You know, native peoples have a culture of salmon fishing
that still exists but it’s also changed a lot too,

00:54:30.000 --> 00:54:34.999
just like the river has changed, you
know, just like nature has changed.

00:54:35.000 --> 00:54:39.999
Our treaty sent for all time

00:54:40.000 --> 00:54:44.999
that we’re able to gather our foods
and medicines and that’s remained

00:54:45.000 --> 00:54:49.999
till the end of time. That’s
why it’s so important that

00:54:50.000 --> 00:54:54.999
we… that we make sure
that the Hanford area is

00:54:55.000 --> 00:54:59.999
accessible and acceptable in a safe mode,

00:55:00.000 --> 00:55:04.999
uh… the natural foods and medicine

00:55:05.000 --> 00:55:09.999
must be usable in the future. But right now,
this administration wants to bypass all

00:55:10.000 --> 00:55:14.999
the environmental law that came and
do a curfew(ph) camp and walk away.

00:55:15.000 --> 00:55:19.999
We’re not gonna accept that
land unless it’s clean,

00:55:20.000 --> 00:55:24.999
but right now, the people would ask me, \"Can we get on
there and gather that foods and medicines, is it safe?\"

00:55:25.000 --> 00:55:29.999
And I’d have to say,
\"Right now I don’t know.\"

00:55:30.000 --> 00:55:34.999
We’d be happy to report that everything was fine out here but
I don’t think it is, I think that there’s caused me concern.

00:55:35.000 --> 00:55:39.999
I think there’s much greater cause to be
concerned for the future as opposed to now

00:55:40.000 --> 00:55:44.999
but I wouldn’t… I wouldn’t take
fish out here and eat them. No way.

00:55:45.000 --> 00:55:49.999
We know, for instance, that

00:55:50.000 --> 00:55:54.999
phosphorus-32 has a half-life of 4.5 days,

00:55:55.000 --> 00:55:59.999
and a phosphorus-32, whenever gets into
a fish, it goes directly to the eye

00:56:00.000 --> 00:56:04.999
and to the soft bone in the
middle of a head of a fish.

00:56:05.000 --> 00:56:09.999
Those of what’s our delicacies to the Yakama people.
You know, I’ve heard, a Hanford scientist say,

00:56:10.000 --> 00:56:14.999
\"Oh, well, it’s a big river.
It dilutes…\" Well, I’m sorry,

00:56:15.000 --> 00:56:19.999
radioactive materials do not dilute,
they don’t burn, they don’t get treated,

00:56:20.000 --> 00:56:24.999
they don’t do anything except sit there
in irradiate. They go through a cycle

00:56:25.000 --> 00:56:29.999
that of decay

00:56:30.000 --> 00:56:34.999
and they’re not gone until that cycle is over.
We know the radiation went down the river,

00:56:35.000 --> 00:56:39.999
we know it covered the West Coast of the
United States. Back in the ‘50s and ‘60s,

00:56:40.000 --> 00:56:44.999
this was a very hot place. Fish and
Wildlife are heavily contaminated back then

00:56:45.000 --> 00:56:49.999
and there’s still a residual amount of contamination
in the silt, other river here and on downstream.

00:56:50.000 --> 00:56:54.999
People, particularly the media

00:56:55.000 --> 00:56:59.999
loves to make statements and one time
statement used to be made at the Columbia

00:57:00.000 --> 00:57:04.999
was the most radioactive
river in the world.

00:57:05.000 --> 00:57:09.999
Okay. My response to that \"Well, yeah, some river
has to be the most radioactive in the world.\"

00:57:10.000 --> 00:57:14.999
They’re not all the same.
So because I measured

00:57:15.000 --> 00:57:19.999
but the question is not is to Colombia the most
radioactive river in the world, the question is,

00:57:20.000 --> 00:57:24.999
is the radioactivity level of the Columbia
hazardous to people or the environment?

00:57:25.000 --> 00:57:29.999
That’s the question. It’s hard to
say how toxic this landscape is

00:57:30.000 --> 00:57:34.999
and if it’s any more toxic than any other
landscape, you know, we go through these things,

00:57:35.000 --> 00:57:39.999
my family and I, we talk about the water,

00:57:40.000 --> 00:57:44.999
and we suck up our… our… our city water,

00:57:45.000 --> 00:57:49.999
which we drink right downstream from Hanford.
It’s sometimes been kind of shocking to us,

00:57:50.000 --> 00:57:54.999
umm… the degree to which people
who’ve lived here for a long time

00:57:55.000 --> 00:57:59.999
are kind of inured or desensitized
to the potential hazard

00:58:00.000 --> 00:58:04.999
of Hanford.

00:58:05.000 --> 00:58:09.999
And maybe they’re just pragmatic and realistic
and we all become a little desensitized,

00:58:10.000 --> 00:58:14.999
umm… at a certain level, I’m thinking
of one person in particular,

00:58:15.000 --> 00:58:19.999
you know, who has told me about how over
exaggerated the risks really are and that,

00:58:20.000 --> 00:58:24.999
you know basically what this
is… is a public works project

00:58:25.000 --> 00:58:29.999
that we’ve put a lot of money
in out here to, you know,

00:58:30.000 --> 00:58:34.999
support this economy that is based in large
part on that federal investment in this area.

00:58:35.000 --> 00:58:39.999
Umm… And so, you know,

00:58:40.000 --> 00:58:44.999
he says it’s much more about economics and
politics than it is about the actual science

00:58:45.000 --> 00:58:49.999
and biology of nuclear cleanup.

00:58:50.000 --> 00:58:54.999
I personally, I have a wife
married for plus years

00:58:55.000 --> 00:58:59.999
and I really love my wife.
I have two children,

00:59:00.000 --> 00:59:04.999
I have two grandchildren.

00:59:05.000 --> 00:59:09.999
I have a dog

00:59:10.000 --> 00:59:14.999
and I’m a devout coward. I really am.

00:59:15.000 --> 00:59:19.999
If I felt there were a hazard living next to the
Hanford site, believe me, I would not be living there

00:59:20.000 --> 00:59:24.999
and what we do is radioactivity releases to
the environment and radiation doses to people

00:59:25.000 --> 00:59:29.999
is set standards that are based upon risks,

00:59:30.000 --> 00:59:34.999
and the risks from the
radioactivity that was released

00:59:35.000 --> 00:59:39.999
to the Hanford are very, very
small on an individual basis.

00:59:40.000 --> 00:59:44.999
Now you could argue, and (inaudible),
you know, this argument has great

00:59:45.000 --> 00:59:49.999
’cause it’s one of the ongoing scientific
arguments of the day that any dose

00:59:50.000 --> 00:59:54.999
of radiation carries with it
a risk, a risk of cancer,

00:59:55.000 --> 00:59:59.999
and it does. But, you know, what do
you consider an acceptable risk,

01:00:00.000 --> 01:00:04.999
one in a million, on in a 100,000,

01:00:05.000 --> 01:00:09.999
one in 10,000… I’m not worried
about Hanford in the river.

01:00:10.000 --> 01:00:14.999
I really don’t, you know, I…
I have to trust the people

01:00:15.000 --> 01:00:19.999
who work there because they live in this
community, they fishing in this river,

01:00:20.000 --> 01:00:24.999
they drink the water from the municipal
water supply which comes out of this river

01:00:25.000 --> 01:00:29.999
and they say that it’s safe. I like
living with my known quantity,

01:00:30.000 --> 01:00:34.999
you know, Hanford’s there,
it’s calculated risk.

01:00:35.000 --> 01:00:39.999
I’m willing to take a calculated risk when
I go to other cities and people find out,

01:00:40.000 --> 01:00:44.999
you know, you drink the water, we swim
in the river and they’re just aghast.

01:00:45.000 --> 01:00:49.999
I mean, that just really surprised and I think
\"Well, do you swim in the river, you’re in Portland.

01:00:50.000 --> 01:00:54.999
Have you looked at the river? That’s
pretty damn nasty, it’s brown.\"

01:00:55.000 --> 01:00:59.999
[music]

01:01:00.000 --> 01:01:04.999
This is where we hang out, we’ve people
that come in. This is the tattoo area.

01:01:05.000 --> 01:01:09.999
This is my body piercing room back here.

01:01:10.000 --> 01:01:14.999
[music]

01:01:15.000 --> 01:01:19.999
It’s pretty much our shop. A lot of customers that come in here,
you know, their moms and dads work in Hanford, if they don’t.

01:01:20.000 --> 01:01:24.999
And we’ve actually had people come from, like alumni for Richland
High School come and get their (inaudible) bombers tattoos here.

01:01:25.000 --> 01:01:29.999
[music]

01:01:30.000 --> 01:01:34.999
Well, I got… this is a atomic sign. I
got it here a couple of months ago,

01:01:35.000 --> 01:01:39.999
it’s just uh… (inaudible) be the best place to get the atomic
sign. This is my favorite tattoo, it’s pretty awesome.

01:01:40.000 --> 01:01:44.999
Hanford’s huge here, I mean, that’s
most of the people who work there to…

01:01:45.000 --> 01:01:49.999
to live and survive. I mean,
that’s pretty much industry here

01:01:50.000 --> 01:01:54.999
and it’s something that people never really
stop talking about, and I mean for good reason.

01:01:55.000 --> 01:01:59.999
[music]

01:02:00.000 --> 01:02:04.999
I’m from New York. I’m sort of been
traveling asked five years since I’ve been

01:02:05.000 --> 01:02:09.999
(inaudible) working in different shops. I
was up in Seattle (inaudible) just working

01:02:10.000 --> 01:02:14.999
and I’ve calling her up
then, \"Oh yeah, (inaudible)

01:02:15.000 --> 01:02:19.999
three hours away.\" Well,
me, I’m from New York,

01:02:20.000 --> 01:02:24.999
you get three hours away like that.
I don’t know,

01:02:25.000 --> 01:02:29.999
I’d have to cross the desert and… I thought (inaudible)
was a suburb of Seattle, wow, what I know,

01:02:30.000 --> 01:02:34.999
they saw my work, inspired by

01:02:35.000 --> 01:02:39.999
(inaudible) in Hanford, (inaudible),

01:02:40.000 --> 01:02:44.999
mushroom clown, that fish
swim up some toxic waste.

01:02:45.000 --> 01:02:49.999
Most of the people that
are worried or freaked

01:02:50.000 --> 01:02:54.999
about Hanford are people that aren’t
from here, they didn’t grow up here,

01:02:55.000 --> 01:02:59.999
you know, they don’t really know that. I mean, the water’s just as
good as anywhere else pretty much and everybody is, you know, fine.

01:03:00.000 --> 01:03:04.999
So it’s… it’s definitely a cool place.
I think that, you know, Hanford

01:03:05.000 --> 01:03:09.999
one way or the other, people they love it or hate it. I
mean, but it’s definitely what shaped this whole area.

01:03:10.000 --> 01:03:14.999
[music]

01:03:15.000 --> 01:03:19.999
If it was just up to this community,
they would be telling congress,

01:03:20.000 --> 01:03:24.999
there’s no risk and Congress would be saying, \"Well,
why the heck should we spend $2 billion a year

01:03:25.000 --> 01:03:29.999
to clean up no risk.\"

01:03:30.000 --> 01:03:34.999
Umm… It’s ironic that it’s the rest
of the region that drives cleanup

01:03:35.000 --> 01:03:39.999
this community and all the economic
growth that’s been brought about

01:03:40.000 --> 01:03:44.999
in the last few years by $2 billion
a year investment in clean up.

01:03:45.000 --> 01:03:49.999
All the new homes and businesses, this town
is booming, all of that will blow away.

01:03:50.000 --> 01:03:54.999
If you admit

01:03:55.000 --> 01:03:59.999
that there is no risk and so they have
to live with this incredible dichotomy.

01:04:00.000 --> 01:04:04.999
Hanford’s got more money per year
than it ever did in the Cold War.

01:04:05.000 --> 01:04:09.999
Uh… It’s got more jobs, it’s a bigger city,

01:04:10.000 --> 01:04:14.999
uh… cleanup has been very, very good to Richland,
and some people see that and they see that

01:04:15.000 --> 01:04:19.999
it’s gonna continue being good for the foreseeable
future because the extent of problems is massive.

01:04:20.000 --> 01:04:24.999
If you look at kind of the
big picture of this place,

01:04:25.000 --> 01:04:29.999
there’s lots of money going into clean up,
not a whole lot of clean up happening,

01:04:30.000 --> 01:04:34.999
failed projects and but… but every year,

01:04:35.000 --> 01:04:39.999
the contaminants spread further, so
they spread further underground.

01:04:40.000 --> 01:04:44.999
Uh… They spread further into the river.

01:04:45.000 --> 01:04:49.999
Well, we do surveys out here, environmental surveys. You
know, we noticed contamination where there wasn’t before

01:04:50.000 --> 01:04:54.999
and is it time to evacuate the Tri Cities.
No. But at some point that might be so.

01:04:55.000 --> 01:05:03.000
[music]

01:05:35.000 --> 01:05:43.000
[music]

01:05:55.000 --> 01:05:59.999
Let me give you the impact that
Hanford has in this economy,

01:06:00.000 --> 01:06:04.999
if I take a look at the average wage in Benton
County, it is the third highest in the state,

01:06:05.000 --> 01:06:09.999
just behind King County with Microsoft
as an homage county with Bowen’s,

01:06:10.000 --> 01:06:14.999
okay. If I take Hanford
out of that average,

01:06:15.000 --> 01:06:19.999
the average wage and Benton
county falls by $11,000 a year

01:06:20.000 --> 01:06:24.999
and looks remarkably like every other
agricultural community in Eastern Washington.

01:06:25.000 --> 01:06:29.999
I don’t think Microsoft in Seattle or Bowen’s in
Seattle are very few communities have ever had their

01:06:30.000 --> 01:06:34.999
primary source of their economic
well-being centered home area.

01:06:35.000 --> 01:06:39.999
And people has asked you what’s going to happen next
year, you don’t know what’s going to happen next year.

01:06:40.000 --> 01:06:44.999
You have the congressional budget, you have the Senate budget, you
have the resolution budget and then what the President wants.

01:06:45.000 --> 01:06:49.999
This whole community sucks
at the government trough

01:06:50.000 --> 01:06:54.999
while rhetorically holding to
some kind of anti-government,

01:06:55.000 --> 01:06:59.999
small government, local control
kind of ethic, you know.

01:07:00.000 --> 01:07:04.999
It’s… it’s kind of… it’s the whole
irony of the American West really,

01:07:05.000 --> 01:07:09.999
you know, political conservatism, at
least before George Bush I guess,

01:07:10.000 --> 01:07:14.999
the second used to be about small
government and local communities.

01:07:15.000 --> 01:07:19.999
And yet this region has
nothing to do with that.

01:07:20.000 --> 01:07:24.999
This region has been shaped by big government,
by federal projects, by outside specialists

01:07:25.000 --> 01:07:29.999
and expertise and outside money.
This area would be

01:07:30.000 --> 01:07:34.999
a little patch of barren sage brush today

01:07:35.000 --> 01:07:39.999
and a few small orchards and family farms.

01:07:40.000 --> 01:07:44.999
If it hadn’t been for a succession
of large federal projects,

01:07:45.000 --> 01:07:49.999
right, first, the dams, and then Hanford

01:07:50.000 --> 01:07:54.999
and then of course the Cold War which
continued to pump money into Hanford

01:07:55.000 --> 01:07:59.999
and then now the nuclear
cleanup project at Hanford.

01:08:00.000 --> 01:08:04.999
I think in the long run communities
such as the Tri Cities

01:08:05.000 --> 01:08:09.999
has to figure out how to get away
from us because we won’t be there.

01:08:10.000 --> 01:08:14.999
The last two times that community housing economic
symposium, the Department of Energy was very clear

01:08:15.000 --> 01:08:19.999
with their message we are leaving.
Someday the cleanup will be done,

01:08:20.000 --> 01:08:24.999
we are leaving and instead
of having 15,000 jobs,

01:08:25.000 --> 01:08:29.999
maybe we only have 5 to 6,000 jobs,
so the issue is how to replace

01:08:30.000 --> 01:08:34.999
9,000 jobs that paid
upwards of $70,000 a year.

01:08:35.000 --> 01:08:39.999
That’s an idea which is, umm…
you know, bring some anxiety

01:08:40.000 --> 01:08:44.999
and so, you know, the way to get around
that and the way to wean ourselves

01:08:45.000 --> 01:08:49.999
from government subsidies and
from the whole legacy of…

01:08:50.000 --> 01:08:54.999
of the nuclear industry
and federal projects

01:08:55.000 --> 01:08:59.999
is to build a new Western economy here.

01:09:00.000 --> 01:09:04.999
Tourism umm… wineries,
basically getting the sort of,

01:09:05.000 --> 01:09:09.999
you know, new, you know, bourgeoisie

01:09:10.000 --> 01:09:14.999
to drive their Subaru’s to
your town and to engage

01:09:15.000 --> 01:09:19.999
in ecotourism or scenic tourism

01:09:20.000 --> 01:09:24.999
or, you know, some kind of
recreational tourism, power boating,

01:09:25.000 --> 01:09:29.999
sports fishing and all
those kinds of things.

01:09:30.000 --> 01:09:34.999
But the gorge amphitheaters are perfect
example. Here’s this wasteland,

01:09:35.000 --> 01:09:39.999
umm… you couldn’t grow anything out here.
(inaudible) and now they’ve built the…

01:09:40.000 --> 01:09:44.999
this outdoor concert venue that for
the last five years has been voted

01:09:45.000 --> 01:09:49.999
the number one concert venue in the
nation, and it’s crazy. It’s beautiful

01:09:50.000 --> 01:09:54.999
you go to those concerts and if
you know the landscape up there,

01:09:55.000 --> 01:09:59.999
you’re looking down into the (inaudible) bay and you
realized that (inaudible) Bay has winter villages,

01:10:00.000 --> 01:10:04.999
Native winter villages all over it and hundreds
of Indian barriers all across that landscape

01:10:05.000 --> 01:10:09.999
just below that gorge amphitheater and
those sites extend clear to the highlands

01:10:10.000 --> 01:10:14.999
behind you at 5,000 feet and there’s
all these buried people out there.

01:10:15.000 --> 01:10:19.999
And you’re looking at the concert and
what you see is that’s the backdrop

01:10:20.000 --> 01:10:24.999
for BB King and purple
silk playing the blues

01:10:25.000 --> 01:10:29.999
and you’re just like, \"Wow!
What irony in this landscape

01:10:30.000 --> 01:10:34.999
and is BB King no worry is, not a
clue, do the concert goers now?

01:10:35.000 --> 01:10:39.999
No. There’s stone, it’s beautiful.\"
When you start to become a geographer,

01:10:40.000 --> 01:10:44.999
you wind up at those places and
sometimes you don’t hear the music,

01:10:45.000 --> 01:10:49.999
the music you’re seeing is this
dance between people and land.

01:10:50.000 --> 01:10:54.999
But we’re seeing a change in the
whole Central Washington area

01:10:55.000 --> 01:10:59.999
from landscape of production
to landscape of consumption,

01:11:00.000 --> 01:11:04.999
and you can see it in agriculture itself
when… when some of these larger farms

01:11:05.000 --> 01:11:09.999
that used to market their
products to the urban areas.

01:11:10.000 --> 01:11:14.999
However, now we are turning into almost
an agro tourism event with a wineries,

01:11:15.000 --> 01:11:19.999
you know, vineyards and not… not just
to grow grapes to ship somewhere

01:11:20.000 --> 01:11:24.999
but to bring tourists in to their
little wine tasting event.

01:11:25.000 --> 01:11:29.999
You know, we moved out here

01:11:30.000 --> 01:11:34.999
because we weren’t… This private out
here, it was not gonna be anymore.

01:11:35.000 --> 01:11:39.999
It’s coming… it’s gonna change.

01:11:40.000 --> 01:11:44.999
They had started to where… I
would say in the last 10 years

01:11:45.000 --> 01:11:49.999
or so they have put in the wineries

01:11:50.000 --> 01:11:54.999
because every time I ride
out there or go up there,

01:11:55.000 --> 01:11:59.999
there’s a different set of, you hear
somebody selling their property

01:12:00.000 --> 01:12:04.999
and they built a new winery.
We’re going to have

01:12:05.000 --> 01:12:09.999
a five-star hotel, uh… big restaurant.

01:12:10.000 --> 01:12:14.999
They’re going to do trails
and they’re gonna do

01:12:15.000 --> 01:12:19.999
horse carriage tours through the winery.

01:12:20.000 --> 01:12:24.999
They’re making it very enticing to
perspective… people that love wine

01:12:25.000 --> 01:12:29.999
to come here and visit their winery
the next Napa Valley of Washington.

01:12:30.000 --> 01:12:34.999
Looking at this I would imagine
that in the next 10 or 15 years

01:12:35.000 --> 01:12:39.999
you’ll see the whole flank of this of Red
Mountain by the way, you’ll see the whole flank

01:12:40.000 --> 01:12:44.999
of Red Mountain covered in wine grapes,

01:12:45.000 --> 01:12:49.999
and I would suspect that you’ll
see several new wineries.

01:12:50.000 --> 01:12:54.999
About I’d say a month ago in the
paper there was a big thing about

01:12:55.000 --> 01:12:59.999
how this big Italian from…
a big Italian winery

01:13:00.000 --> 01:13:04.999
had come out and they actually took

01:13:05.000 --> 01:13:09.999
a gold shrivel up there
and turned to the dirt.

01:13:10.000 --> 01:13:14.999
Some of the people that are up on
the hill have sold their property.

01:13:15.000 --> 01:13:19.999
One girl, she’s going to stay there on one
acre and they’re going to put their wine…

01:13:20.000 --> 01:13:24.999
their vineyards around her, so I’m kind of
waiting to see what offers go up on the hill.

01:13:25.000 --> 01:13:29.999
She can get 20,000 acre just for
acreage without water rights,

01:13:30.000 --> 01:13:34.999
30,000 with water rights

01:13:35.000 --> 01:13:39.999
and 40,000 if you have vineyard and that’s
how much the property value has increased.

01:13:40.000 --> 01:13:44.999
I haven’t however gotten
notice on my taxes.

01:13:45.000 --> 01:13:49.999
Well, you see my place here on
a PR and those are rich people

01:13:50.000 --> 01:13:54.999
and we’re getting screwed, (inaudible)
pretty much simplifies it (inaudible).

01:13:55.000 --> 01:13:59.999
That man right there next door he’s
been getting soaked out as well.

01:14:00.000 --> 01:14:04.999
Lady right across, saw wherever the horse
barns are, she just re-drilled her well.

01:14:05.000 --> 01:14:09.999
The people right there (inaudible) the other house just re-drilled
their well. Yeah, water’s an issue but you’re never gonna prove it

01:14:10.000 --> 01:14:14.999
if their second is dry. Vineyard
zone get any special treatment

01:14:15.000 --> 01:14:19.999
for water rights, although we have
encountered a public perception,

01:14:20.000 --> 01:14:24.999
they were making money, hand over
fist and so we shouldn’t be entitled

01:14:25.000 --> 01:14:29.999
to anymore water rights, to grow
grapes or something like that.

01:14:30.000 --> 01:14:34.999
I mean that the ideas that were just empowering the rich and
that you got to leave the rest of it for people to enjoy.

01:14:35.000 --> 01:14:39.999
Well, there aren’t a whole bunch of people that I
see enjoying trumping around out in the desert,

01:14:40.000 --> 01:14:44.999
there are quite a few that
they run and bike up this road

01:14:45.000 --> 01:14:49.999
that has only been here for four years and if
we hadn’t done that and developed this areas,

01:14:50.000 --> 01:14:54.999
an agricultural area, it
will be all carved up

01:14:55.000 --> 01:14:59.999
with little mobile home estates or… or big rich mansions
that you see in other places of the tri-cities.

01:15:00.000 --> 01:15:04.999
They just… they all carved up there.

01:15:05.000 --> 01:15:13.000
[music]

01:15:20.000 --> 01:15:24.999
I mean, it’s… it’s all tourist
attraction which is a

01:15:25.000 --> 01:15:29.999
big contrast to all of the
Hanford stuff that’s gone on.

01:15:30.000 --> 01:15:34.999
Umm… As things decommission there,

01:15:35.000 --> 01:15:39.999
they’re not gonna need as many people. There’s
gonna need at least something else here,

01:15:40.000 --> 01:15:44.999
so in one respect, it’s good. The… the…

01:15:45.000 --> 01:15:49.999
the visitors, the winery cultures
that are coming in… the…

01:15:50.000 --> 01:15:54.999
just all the different types of things

01:15:55.000 --> 01:15:59.999
that are gonna entice people to visit tri-cities.
These… these wineries are gonna be one of them.

01:16:00.000 --> 01:16:04.999
[music]

01:16:05.000 --> 01:16:09.999
Richland in this whole area,

01:16:10.000 --> 01:16:14.999
uh… that Tri Cities has really caught
between an older West economy…

01:16:15.000 --> 01:16:19.999
an older western economy
and this new west economy

01:16:20.000 --> 01:16:24.999
and so it’s interesting to see which way
this community is gonna be able to go.

01:16:25.000 --> 01:16:29.999
I think the community is gonna be
constrained not only by its ideas

01:16:30.000 --> 01:16:34.999
and by… I think its heart,
which still I think resides

01:16:35.000 --> 01:16:39.999
in that older western economy,

01:16:40.000 --> 01:16:44.999
but also by that bias against
landscapes like this.

01:16:45.000 --> 01:16:49.999
Urbanites don’t wanna come from
Seattle and come to the Tri Cities,

01:16:50.000 --> 01:16:54.999
umm… because this isn’t really nature.

01:16:55.000 --> 01:16:59.999
This isn’t really a pristine landscape. I think
embodied in that kind of attitude about wilderness

01:17:00.000 --> 01:17:04.999
is a kind of privileging of one kind of
wilderness over another kind of wilderness,

01:17:05.000 --> 01:17:09.999
you know, that certain landscapes,

01:17:10.000 --> 01:17:14.999
umm… you know, huge granite
faces an alpine landscapes

01:17:15.000 --> 01:17:19.999
and meadows and rivers and cascading
waterfalls, these things are nature

01:17:20.000 --> 01:17:24.999
that are sublime nature. In this
landscape, it’s not nature,

01:17:25.000 --> 01:17:29.999
it’s one that’s been, you know, run roughshod over
by… by mankind. It’s been transformed by mankind

01:17:30.000 --> 01:17:34.999
and then it also doesn’t have the
kind of majestic or sublime elements

01:17:35.000 --> 01:17:39.999
of what we as modern humans as modern Americans
usually associate with this idea of wilderness.

01:17:40.000 --> 01:17:44.999
[sil.]

01:17:45.000 --> 01:17:49.999
My father was a mountain pastor,
little country churches,

01:17:50.000 --> 01:17:54.999
uh… an… an old cow boy

01:17:55.000 --> 01:17:59.999
in Idaho in eastern Oregon and I
didn’t plan on being a preacher,

01:18:00.000 --> 01:18:04.999
I planned on being a lawyer
but I really loved my father

01:18:05.000 --> 01:18:09.999
and watch what he was doing and felt God call me to
the… the ministry. I grew up in Northeastern Oregon

01:18:10.000 --> 01:18:14.999
and there’s a boy, (inaudible)
mountains, the (inaudible) was my love

01:18:15.000 --> 01:18:19.999
and used to hunting fish there. And so
coming out of the desert was a shock to me

01:18:20.000 --> 01:18:24.999
and I decided that we’ve created
our own mountains here.

01:18:25.000 --> 01:18:29.999
[sil.]

01:18:30.000 --> 01:18:34.999
We’d like to take everybody up in
the mountains to a great waterfall

01:18:35.000 --> 01:18:39.999
but its a little bit harder range so
we’re bringing the waterfall here.

01:18:40.000 --> 01:18:44.999
And instead of having a Las Vegas
waterfall, made out of false material,

01:18:45.000 --> 01:18:49.999
it’ll have a natural rocks from this
area and kinda tie us into creation

01:18:50.000 --> 01:18:54.999
and the… and the power of creation.
People will sit inside the sanctuary,

01:18:55.000 --> 01:18:59.999
have a big glass wall and a 20-foot doors
will open at certain time and worship service

01:19:00.000 --> 01:19:04.999
would they can see and feel the thunder of the
waterfall, like us I wanted to shift gears

01:19:05.000 --> 01:19:09.999
I want to be able to put it full
force, now the flood and I know,

01:19:10.000 --> 01:19:14.999
I just kinda shake the whole building and then
I want to have a button that says serenity,

01:19:15.000 --> 01:19:19.999
so that’s just streaming over
like a very peaceful sounds.

01:19:20.000 --> 01:19:24.999
One of the major efforts in church architecture
day is to build a box, big huge box,

01:19:25.000 --> 01:19:29.999
mega churches. They get
thousands people in there.

01:19:30.000 --> 01:19:34.999
I think it’s wonderful. They turn the box this
way and they put little platform down here,

01:19:35.000 --> 01:19:39.999
they have little windows that they can close so they can have
graphics and I am not against churches with rock bands or graphics,

01:19:40.000 --> 01:19:44.999
I think they should do the best they can,
show fields of flowers in the Alps and so on,

01:19:45.000 --> 01:19:49.999
umm… but I think we’re just going a
step further and focusing on this,

01:19:50.000 --> 01:19:54.999
and you know, I would hope that we would
influence churches to move in this direction.

01:19:55.000 --> 01:19:59.999
I don’t know why every little country church couldn’t
have a glass wall (inaudible) and a waterfall.

01:20:00.000 --> 01:20:04.999
[sil.]

01:20:05.000 --> 01:20:09.999
This landscape is a human created landscape

01:20:10.000 --> 01:20:14.999
and I think the entire North American
continent was a cultural landscape

01:20:15.000 --> 01:20:19.999
and still is a cultural landscapes
so it hasn’t changed in that regard,

01:20:20.000 --> 01:20:24.999
it just changed in that the cultures who now control the
landscape have very different ideas about what they wanna take

01:20:25.000 --> 01:20:29.999
from the landscape and how they wanna shape the
landscape. But human beings are always gonna transform

01:20:30.000 --> 01:20:34.999
the land and transform the landscape because
we’re humans and that’s what we do.

01:20:35.000 --> 01:20:39.999
[sil.]

01:20:40.000 --> 01:20:44.999
There’s a jack rabbit. Look
at the size of this guy.

01:20:45.000 --> 01:20:49.999
They run like little coyotes.

01:20:50.000 --> 01:20:54.999
They haul but (inaudible). I’m a
developer here in the tri cities.

01:20:55.000 --> 01:20:59.999
And what I do is develop lots.
This is 53 residential lots

01:21:00.000 --> 01:21:04.999
here and I’m running into some
serious rock as you can see.

01:21:05.000 --> 01:21:09.999
It look good.

01:21:10.000 --> 01:21:14.999
I had the geo tech come out, they
said there are several outcroppings.

01:21:15.000 --> 01:21:19.999
My neighbor said sure, there’s outcroppings, there’s
nothing you can’t chewing your way through.

01:21:20.000 --> 01:21:24.999
I blasted the whole site, I’m still
chewing my way through. It’s been a year.

01:21:25.000 --> 01:21:29.999
This project was a four and half to
five-month project. It’s now month 12.

01:21:30.000 --> 01:21:38.000
[sil.]

01:21:40.000 --> 01:21:44.999
This is… Well, this was… This would
be probably one of the worst spots

01:21:45.000 --> 01:21:49.999
when I first came, as we were
blasting, we would go down

01:21:50.000 --> 01:21:54.999
10, 12, 14 feet. We drill
through one, through another,

01:21:55.000 --> 01:21:59.999
and through another blow it, expecting
to come out with several chunks

01:22:00.000 --> 01:22:04.999
but what we came out was volkswagen size boulders that
were on top with holes in them because they blast

01:22:05.000 --> 01:22:09.999
the entire boulders out of the ground. If you
see over here and this shoveling bucket,

01:22:10.000 --> 01:22:14.999
there’s one tooth left of five and it’s…

01:22:15.000 --> 01:22:19.999
it’s pretty wore out, we
just left this bucket

01:22:20.000 --> 01:22:24.999
because about dead. This is what part rocks

01:22:25.000 --> 01:22:29.999
does equipment after about
nine months of constant use.

01:22:30.000 --> 01:22:34.999
I’m trying to accomplish removing the rock

01:22:35.000 --> 01:22:39.999
and getting out a subdivision with a
little piece of ass(ph) still left.

01:22:40.000 --> 01:22:44.999
I don’t know what I did to deserve
it, (inaudible) just recover,

01:22:45.000 --> 01:22:49.999
move on, get out the spanking
line and produce some more.

01:22:50.000 --> 01:22:54.999
I can make some money on it. I mean I like it, but
I don’t like the fact that I’m not making money.

01:22:55.000 --> 01:22:59.999
I mean, I… I did a year’s worth
of grief in a $3.5 million risk.

01:23:00.000 --> 01:23:04.999
Builders are making money, the realtors are making
money, the (inaudible) people are making money.

01:23:05.000 --> 01:23:09.999
I’m sick of it. They are premier lots

01:23:10.000 --> 01:23:14.999
but I do have an obligation to the bank so I have
to give away them certain amount of time too,

01:23:15.000 --> 01:23:19.999
as every month goes by $15,000 more
interests goes out of my pocket.

01:23:20.000 --> 01:23:24.999
So I’m stuck, you know, between
a rock and a hard place.

01:23:25.000 --> 01:23:29.999
[sil.]

01:23:30.000 --> 01:23:38.000
[music]

01:24:00.000 --> 01:24:08.000
[music]

01:24:25.000 --> 01:24:29.999
There’s some beautiful examples

01:24:30.000 --> 01:24:34.999
of extremely for urban design and
planning, all around Tri-Cities area.

01:24:35.000 --> 01:24:39.999
And we drive through the subdivisions
out there and look at them.

01:24:40.000 --> 01:24:44.999
You’re in a desert, this
watering lawns, right.

01:24:45.000 --> 01:24:49.999
You’re… you’re mimicking California
forms of subdivisions with

01:24:50.000 --> 01:24:54.999
(inaudible) acts that go nowhere. We don’t even know
where we are. They’re all clear bilinear streets.

01:24:55.000 --> 01:24:59.999
They’re all fronted by
garages and at some point,

01:25:00.000 --> 01:25:04.999
the Tri Cities becomes like every place else. Our
students come to us and I call them video babies.

01:25:05.000 --> 01:25:09.999
That’s how refer these
guys because… (inaudible).

01:25:10.000 --> 01:25:14.999
Yeah, but everything they know came from a
television set. You walk into a class of students,

01:25:15.000 --> 01:25:19.999
brand new freshmen’s, right. Coming
out, leaving home for the first time,

01:25:20.000 --> 01:25:24.999
their hormones are raging, they’re thinking about beer, all kinds of
things. They walk in… How many of you the camped out last summer?

01:25:25.000 --> 01:25:29.999
Three hands go up… In a class of 80.
Out of 80 students,

01:25:30.000 --> 01:25:34.999
three people slept out last night. How
many of you have ever dug a hole?

01:25:35.000 --> 01:25:39.999
I’m trying to teach these people
about soil, right, soil layers. Too.

01:25:40.000 --> 01:25:44.999
You know, this is still an affordable area.

01:25:45.000 --> 01:25:49.999
You still get a nice light, you still get a
view. You still have affordable housing.

01:25:50.000 --> 01:25:54.999
If they come over to Hanford and Hanford’s
constantly still being cleaned up,

01:25:55.000 --> 01:25:59.999
supposed to be till 2048.
If they hits a flat spot,

01:26:00.000 --> 01:26:04.999
Hanford will be laying off
and even if it lays off now

01:26:05.000 --> 01:26:09.999
and dumps a bunch of their people,

01:26:10.000 --> 01:26:14.999
the economy within the Tri Cities will
sustain itself. It will be like Boeing

01:26:15.000 --> 01:26:19.999
in 1962, shut off the lights
when you’re leaving Seattle.

01:26:20.000 --> 01:26:24.999
It won’t be the drastic downfall like it used to
be. Well, just flat and maybe go down a little

01:26:25.000 --> 01:26:29.999
but it will go down all the
way, that’s what I’m counting.

01:26:30.000 --> 01:26:34.999
Urbanization, golf courses,
wall to wall housing,

01:26:35.000 --> 01:26:39.999
asphalt,

01:26:40.000 --> 01:26:44.999
urban sprawl is a serious concern.

01:26:45.000 --> 01:26:49.999
When I walk into the city, department
here, I can walk right down the hall,

01:26:50.000 --> 01:26:54.999
all right, even talk to the secretary
walk right in and sit on top of them.

01:26:55.000 --> 01:26:59.999
Their pro growth and they’re taken
advantage of it while they can

01:27:00.000 --> 01:27:04.999
and it’s good for everybody in the Tri Cities.
Basically it was desert wasteland paying

01:27:05.000 --> 01:27:09.999
very little to no taxes, now it’s usable
property. People are gonna be living in,

01:27:10.000 --> 01:27:14.999
paying taxes on, building on, the
economy gets fed, the… the framers,

01:27:15.000 --> 01:27:19.999
the foundation guys, the roofers,
all of the interior people,

01:27:20.000 --> 01:27:24.999
all the window people and every piece of
subcontractor that goes along the way

01:27:25.000 --> 01:27:29.999
and every materialists that they get to
buy, feeds their families. Every person

01:27:30.000 --> 01:27:34.999
that does working on there, feeds
their family, and so on and so on,

01:27:35.000 --> 01:27:39.999
and if you’re times that by 53, which is this… this
small area, and if you have that all over the place,

01:27:40.000 --> 01:27:44.999
it actually feeds the economy. People
think mostly in four-year spasms,

01:27:45.000 --> 01:27:49.999
you know, you’re in the College four years,

01:27:50.000 --> 01:27:54.999
we get a president for four years, that’s
about as far as people wanna think.

01:27:55.000 --> 01:27:59.999
But we gotta think further head now.

01:28:00.000 --> 01:28:04.999
[sil.]

01:28:05.000 --> 01:28:09.999
We used

01:28:10.000 --> 01:28:14.999
sit right across here, right
through there at the jack rabbits,

01:28:15.000 --> 01:28:19.999
right down there where that blue houses,

01:28:20.000 --> 01:28:24.999
behind that tree fort there,

01:28:25.000 --> 01:28:29.999
that was all alfalfa at one time.
We couldn’t get water for that

01:28:30.000 --> 01:28:34.999
acreage down there, so we decided
to sell it to help pay for the farm

01:28:35.000 --> 01:28:39.999
and they turned it into development
and then it just grew from there.

01:28:40.000 --> 01:28:44.999
It’s hard to know what to do and there’s
where development is going on here,

01:28:45.000 --> 01:28:49.999
you know, on one hand,
there’s the city moving out

01:28:50.000 --> 01:28:54.999
and they’re right on your doorstep. Now on the other hand,
it takes eight years or so, six maybe if you’re lucky

01:28:55.000 --> 01:28:59.999
to get a good crop off a cherry tree.

01:29:00.000 --> 01:29:04.999
So, you know, what’s going to happen in
six or eight years where it’s grown here.

01:29:05.000 --> 01:29:09.999
I don’t know why the cities
always have to move out

01:29:10.000 --> 01:29:14.999
through the agricultural and it seems like
it. There’s some guy has got a nice farm

01:29:15.000 --> 01:29:19.999
and next thing, you know, there’s a
house next to him and bingo, it’s just,

01:29:20.000 --> 01:29:24.999
you know, the domino effect. And
it’s… I’m not really angry,

01:29:25.000 --> 01:29:29.999
it’s just… it’s just… there’s not too many
more places to go now know though, you know,

01:29:30.000 --> 01:29:34.999
everything’s developed everywhere. That
40 acres I bought off the French’s down

01:29:35.000 --> 01:29:39.999
the road and put a 130 lots on
was all mostly apple orchard,

01:29:40.000 --> 01:29:44.999
and the apple industry fell out.

01:29:45.000 --> 01:29:49.999
It really wasn’t then… they
were just doing their business

01:29:50.000 --> 01:29:54.999
and the city grew around them. It’s not the same
type of living as what they’re used to. Meanwhile,

01:29:55.000 --> 01:29:59.999
you picked apples and planted apples
and generations in 40 and 50 years,

01:30:00.000 --> 01:30:04.999
all you’re doing is working your
butt off like everybody else.

01:30:05.000 --> 01:30:09.999
And it comes a time where it’s like, \"All this wasn’t for
nothing. I don’t have to do this the rest of my life.\"

01:30:10.000 --> 01:30:14.999
You turned on enough calendar pages,
you turn around one day and \"Wow!

01:30:15.000 --> 01:30:19.999
This is worth a lot of money.\"
Now I live on I stress,

01:30:20.000 --> 01:30:24.999
that’s what I do. That’s how
I… that’s how I get my juice

01:30:25.000 --> 01:30:29.999
and they live on serenity sometimes
they don’t even know it.

01:30:30.000 --> 01:30:34.999
To mem, there would be a lovely life. I couldn’t
do it but I can see how they can grow to be old,

01:30:35.000 --> 01:30:39.999
you know, and serine. That’s what I think
of them, they’re beautiful people.

01:30:40.000 --> 01:30:48.000
[sil.]

01:30:50.000 --> 01:30:54.999
Oh man!

01:30:55.000 --> 01:30:59.999
You know, they’re ready.

01:31:00.000 --> 01:31:04.999
I’m addicted to these things I think.

01:31:05.000 --> 01:31:09.999
I eat like between five and
seven of these things a day.

01:31:10.000 --> 01:31:14.999
These…

01:31:15.000 --> 01:31:19.999
Yeah, one day I sprained this cherry trees,

01:31:20.000 --> 01:31:24.999
I came down over the hill. I’m
looking right in this guy’s bedroom,

01:31:25.000 --> 01:31:29.999
he’s in his shorts, you know, and I’m
glad, just didn’t see anything else.

01:31:30.000 --> 01:31:34.999
I feel like I’m intruding
sometimes though, you know,

01:31:35.000 --> 01:31:39.999
it’s going like gangbusters,

01:31:40.000 --> 01:31:44.999
it’s just gonna come all the
way the river probably.

01:31:45.000 --> 01:31:49.999
I just wonder when it’s gonna stop, if it
is, some guys don’t think it’s gonna stop.

01:31:50.000 --> 01:31:54.999
So it’s gonna look different
probably five years, 20 years.

01:31:55.000 --> 01:31:59.999
I don’t know I think
there’ll be houses here.

01:32:00.000 --> 01:32:04.999
Myself.

01:32:05.000 --> 01:32:09.999
It’s pretty nice view. I like that view.

01:32:10.000 --> 01:32:14.999
[sil.]

01:32:15.000 --> 01:32:23.000
[music]

01:32:50.000 --> 01:32:54.999
This is an interesting time to be alive. What’s
coming in all of our lives, it’s changed.

01:32:55.000 --> 01:32:59.999
(inaudible). On a scale we haven’t even
begun to appreciate, and people are like,

01:33:00.000 --> 01:33:04.999
\"Whoa! I don’t know why things are going
so wrong today, must be religious problem.

01:33:05.000 --> 01:33:09.999
It’s landscape problem. Yeah, but it’s not just urban
plan or… or urban regional plan that can fix this somehow

01:33:10.000 --> 01:33:14.999
because there’s greater
cultural forces of work.

01:33:15.000 --> 01:33:19.999
We took some students to spring into Hells
Canyon, took them up there (inaudible),

01:33:20.000 --> 01:33:24.999
put them on a… on a river barge for
five days, they were amazed at night,

01:33:25.000 --> 01:33:29.999
there were that many stars in the sky.
These people are 20 years old

01:33:30.000 --> 01:33:34.999
and they’ve never sat where there’s no light
pollution and looked at those stars move

01:33:35.000 --> 01:33:39.999
and some of them were like,
\"Well, they’ve moved.

01:33:40.000 --> 01:33:44.999
They thought the stars… these
are coincident and I… Yeah,

01:33:45.000 --> 01:33:49.999
if we ever stayed up the entire
night and watched it rotate.

01:33:50.000 --> 01:33:54.999
What scares me is that when you get
that far removed from landscapes,

01:33:55.000 --> 01:33:59.999
it gets very easy to agree to alternative.
When your experiences

01:34:00.000 --> 01:34:04.999
are confined to inside a car and you don’t
know the sound of birds in a riparian gallery,

01:34:05.000 --> 01:34:09.999
why do you care about (inaudible) tropical bird
migrations? Or the loss of particular habitats

01:34:10.000 --> 01:34:14.999
for the clear-cutting of forests,
or the fact that (inaudible)

01:34:15.000 --> 01:34:19.999
almost drinkable here by the
time you get to Tri Cities,

01:34:20.000 --> 01:34:24.999
you shouldn’t eat fish out of it. It’s
a sewer, an irrigation ditch sewer.

01:34:25.000 --> 01:34:29.999
Bob and I maybe weirdos but there’s a
lot of the South there, to grow gardens

01:34:30.000 --> 01:34:34.999
and worry about where your food comes from and how clean it is
to eat and whether or not you drink out of a stream or not.

01:34:35.000 --> 01:34:39.999
Those are real basic human things,
stick close to your food,

01:34:40.000 --> 01:34:44.999
understand your home, know what it
means to have a sense of place,

01:34:45.000 --> 01:34:49.999
guard your family and… and
try to grow a community.

01:34:50.000 --> 01:34:54.999
And no where your water
goes first deploy land.

01:34:55.000 --> 01:35:03.000
[music]

01:35:20.000 --> 01:35:24.999
[sil.]

01:35:25.000 --> 01:35:30.000
[music]