No Más Bebés
- Description
- Reviews
- Citation
- Cataloging
- Transcript
NO MÁS BEBÉS tells the story of Mexican immigrant mothers who sued doctors, the state, and the U.S. government after they were sterilized while giving birth at Los Angeles County General Hospital during the 1970s. Alongside an intrepid, 26-year-old Chicana lawyer and armed with hospital records secretly gathered by a whistle-blowing young doctor, these mothers stood up to powerful institutions in the name of justice. Their landmark 1975 civil rights lawsuit, Madrigal v. Quilligan, asserted that a woman’s right to bear a child is guaranteed under the Supreme Court decision Roe v. Wade. This EMMY® nominated film lifts up the significant contribution of Chicana activists who sought to redefine reproductive politics — not only as the right to abortion, but also the human right to bear a child. Their demand that the needs of poor women and women of color be heard resonates powerfully, as women’s reproductive choice is under attack and the reproductive justice movement struggles to ensure that all women have a voice in the debate.
Video Librarian ★ ★ ★ 1/2
Reviewed by Aud: C, P. (P. Hall)
"Renee Tajima-Peña’s PBS-aired documentary focuses on a shameful chapter in California history involving one of the most horrifying denials of civil rights imaginable. During the 1960s and early ‘70s, the Los Angeles County-USC Medical Center tricked and bullied Mexican immigrant women who gave birth through emergency cesarean sections into signing documents authorizing tubal ligation surgery that effectively sterilized them. In 1975, 10 of these women joined in the Madrigal v. Quilligan lawsuit that sought damages from the hospital, the state, and the federal government. No Más Bebés interviews several of the women behind the lawsuit, who talk about the circumstances that resulted in their loss of reproductive rights—including doctors withholding pain medication until they signed consent forms—and their shock when they discovered what had happened. The medical community argued that the procedures were undertaken because doctors felt the women faced health problems, and most had already borne several children. The film points out that during this period a widespread fear of overpopulation resulted in federal funding for population control studies. But limits on childbearing were never suggested for white women with large families, which raises the shocking specter of racially motivated eugenics. A disturbing and heartbreaking documentary, this is highly recommended."
California State University San Marcos | Michelle A. Holling, Ph.D., Professor of Communication and Ethnic Studies Program
"No Más Bebés allows viewers to hear first-hand from Chicana plaintiffs thereby illustrating the power of testimonio--the individual and collective retelling of racialized, gendered, and classed wrongs--to document a horrendous medical practice enacted against a population of Chicanas. Their voices, which contribute to the herstory of Chicana feminism and activism, augmented by interviews with key figures surrounding the case add depth and complexity to viewers’ understanding of the social forces Chicanas and their attorneys contended with. This documentary is a must see for anyone interested in matters of social justice, ethics, reproductive justice, gender-women's and ethnic studies."
The Washington Post | Reviewed by David Montgomery
"It does not spoil the ending to say that the case helped lead to bilingual consent forms and bilingual counseling. Yet in those contested times, even the remedies were difficult to agree on. Some Chicana activists favored a waiting period before sterilization could take place, while some white feminists considered sterilization-on-demand to be a reproductive right. What is undebatable is the emotional pain of the women who unwittingly lost the ability to have more children. They mourn for the lives that never came to be. Many mourned in secret: Their sterilization was a source of shame that they hid even from the children they had before the procedure. Some of those children, now adults, found out only when the filmmakers came to speak to their mothers."
KCET | Reviewed by Betty Martín
"Largely based on Espino's research, No Mas Bebés shows how Chicana feminists contributed to the concept of reproductive justice by understanding the experiences of the Mexican immigrant women that bore the case. During this time, many white feminists were calling for abortion and sterilization on demand as a legal right. Madrigal vs. Quilligan showed that for other women what was actually at risk, was the right to bear a child. "This was the precedent of informing the women's rights movement, that there were these other issues taking place at the intersection of gender, race and class," Espino asserts. Recent events speak to the relevancy of the film today. The sterilization of women in California prisons in 2010, or a current law, known as Family Cap, which denies women on welfare additional assistance after the birth of another child, demonstrate the challenges poor women face in particular. 'No Mas Bebés' continues the ongoing conversation on women's reproductive rights."
Indiewire | Reviewed by Katie Walsh
"The fight for reproductive justice is a fight for humanity, a fight to define personal worth through the ability to have autonomy over one’s body. Documentary 'No Mas Bebes,' directed by Renee Tajima-Peña, is a beautiful depiction of this, and a definitive reinserting of the voices and experiences of women of color into this ongoing struggle...This incredibly moving story details how this lawsuit brought about regulatory change and exposes this all-too-recent horrific and biased practice. These women, sterilized against their consent in their early 20s and 30s demonstrate incredible strength of character in fighting for the right of all women to choose how and when they want to have children.”
Films for the Feminist Classroom | Reviewed by Barbara Gurr
"No Màs Bebés provides a critically necessary intervention into mainstream reproductive rights discourse in several ways. Its focus on the racialized, classed experiences of Mexican immigrant women in southern California highlights the complexities of the abortion debates as they occurred in the late 1960s and 1970s; while some women fought for the right to obtain a safe abortion and contraception, others were stripped of the right to have children. These tensions continue to be relevant in many ways today, as surgical sterilizations remain disproportionately high in communities of color and poor communities."
Citation
Main credits
Tajima-Pena, Renee (film director)
Tajima-Pena, Renee (film producer)
Espino, Virginia (film producer)
Hurtado, Maria (on-screen participant)
Hermosillo, Consuelo (on-screen participant)
Hernández, Antonia (on-screen participant)
Rosenfeld, Bernard (on-screen participant)
Other credits
Director of photography, Claudio Rocha; editor, Johanna Demetrakas; original music, Bronwen Jones.
Distributor subjects
Latina Studies; Reproductive Rights; Civil Rights; American History; Medical Ethics; Race & EthnicityKeywords
WEBVTT
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♪ ♪
00:00:22.250 --> 00:00:27.125
♪ ♪
00:00:40.291 --> 00:00:44.708
♪ ♪
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ROSENFELD: They were
extremely fearful being
in a foreign situation.
00:01:56.291 --> 00:01:59.875
Being told that you need
emergency caesarian section,
00:01:59.958 --> 00:02:03.333
you can feel blood
pouring down their leg and
00:02:03.416 --> 00:02:06.291
at that time signing a
consent for tubal ligation.
00:02:07.000 --> 00:02:09.480
CONSUELO: The doctor walked in
and said \"Everything went fine,\"
00:02:10.208 --> 00:02:12.166
and I said well \"Doctor
what am I going to use?
00:02:12.250 --> 00:02:16.000
Am I gonna use birth control,
or they\'re gonna to put me the,
00:02:16.166 --> 00:02:17.750
whatever I was using before?\"
00:02:17.833 --> 00:02:19.000
He goes \"No, you
don\'t need anything.
00:02:19.083 --> 00:02:21.083
We cut your tubes.\"
And I said \"Why?\"
00:02:21.541 --> 00:02:23.916
He goes \"Well,
you signed for it.\"
00:02:24.041 --> 00:02:26.833
and I said, \"Me?\" I go
\"I don\'t remember nothing.\"
00:02:27.458 --> 00:02:29.000
ANTONIA: My youngest sister was
00:02:29.083 --> 00:02:33.250
born in LA County
USC Medical Center in 1968
00:02:34.458 --> 00:02:36.708
and this could have
happened to my mom.
00:02:37.500 --> 00:02:41.625
Umm, you know, the idea that,
this poor immigrant woman with
00:02:41.750 --> 00:02:44.125
six kids, why in the heck
does she want a seventh kid?
00:02:45.000 --> 00:02:47.281
CRONKHITE: There was shock,
last month over the revelation
00:02:47.333 --> 00:02:50.458
that the State of Virginia
sterilized thousands of persons
00:02:50.541 --> 00:02:54.083
between 1922 and 72 in
a program aimed at ridding
00:02:54.458 --> 00:02:56.416
the state of
so-called misfits.
00:02:56.833 --> 00:02:59.375
Now it develops that
similar programs were carried
00:02:59.458 --> 00:03:01.250
out in some 30 states.
00:03:01.416 --> 00:03:02.666
REPORTER: The documents
collected from state records
00:03:02.750 --> 00:03:05.500
indicate the vast majority
of the sterilizations took place
00:03:05.583 --> 00:03:08.083
in 12 states with
California accounting for
00:03:08.166 --> 00:03:10.125
nearly a third of the total.
00:03:31.791 --> 00:03:33.875
♪ ♪
00:04:28.125 --> 00:04:30.541
♪ Todo lo que quiero
yo lo hare en la vida ♪
00:04:31.375 --> 00:04:34.458
♪ La fe que me nace
es por ti mi vida ♪
00:04:35.583 --> 00:04:38.625
♪ Todo lo que quiero
yo lo hare en la vida ♪♪
00:04:47.875 --> 00:04:51.041
♪ La fe que me nace
es por ti mi vida ♪
00:04:52.125 --> 00:04:55.333
♪ Todo lo que quiero
yo lo hare en la vida ♪
00:04:56.291 --> 00:04:59.333
♪ Todo lo que tengo ♪♪
00:05:33.583 --> 00:05:37.458
ROSENFELD: One of the senior
residents showed us a tubal
00:05:37.708 --> 00:05:42.083
ligation book, where you sign
up women for a tubal ligation.
00:05:42.375 --> 00:05:45.833
And, and he said I want,
I want you to ask all these
00:05:45.916 --> 00:05:48.333
girls if they
want their tubes tied.
00:05:48.541 --> 00:05:50.875
I don\'t care how old they are.
00:05:51.333 --> 00:05:53.208
And I said \"Did you
ask them during labor?\"
00:05:53.958 --> 00:05:55.958
And he said \"Sure,
after the 8th pain.
00:05:56.500 --> 00:05:58.333
That\'s how it\'s
done isn\'t it?\"
00:05:59.125 --> 00:06:02.458
KREITZER: Tubal ligation
takes place at the end of
00:06:02.541 --> 00:06:04.458
the caesarian section.
00:06:04.541 --> 00:06:06.250
You\'ve sewn the uterus up.
00:06:06.333 --> 00:06:09.375
The baby\'s been delivered,
the mother is stable.
00:06:09.458 --> 00:06:12.458
And the tubes get tied.
00:06:13.250 --> 00:06:15.375
Cut, tied, burned,
whatever was done.
00:06:15.625 --> 00:06:18.500
The idea being that
these patients are not
00:06:18.583 --> 00:06:20.208
to get pregnant again.
00:06:31.291 --> 00:06:33.000
It\'s too much pain.
00:06:35.208 --> 00:06:38.208
BENKER: I saw doctors
re-hold up a syringe and say,
00:06:38.291 --> 00:06:39.750
you know that,
\"You want this shot?
00:06:39.833 --> 00:06:41.833
You want this shot?
No mas dolor.\"
00:06:42.041 --> 00:06:43.041
This, showing the needle
00:06:43.125 --> 00:06:47.125
\"This will take away
the pain. Sign, sign.\"
00:06:53.541 --> 00:06:54.916
REPORTER: This is the
emergency department at
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Los Angeles County
USC Medical Center.
00:06:58.166 --> 00:06:59.416
Uh, we see approximately.
00:06:59.500 --> 00:07:01.791
BLANCHETTE: It was a war zone,
we called it the war zone.
00:07:03.041 --> 00:07:06.041
You\'d open the doors to labor
and delivery and there would be,
00:07:06.125 --> 00:07:09.583
women on gurneys laboring,
uh, in the hallways because
00:07:09.666 --> 00:07:11.416
we didn\'t have enough room.
00:07:13.791 --> 00:07:15.791
FREEMAN: The hospital
served these,
00:07:15.875 --> 00:07:18.875
they were indigent
people by and large.
00:07:18.958 --> 00:07:21.500
At that time
private physicians, uh,
00:07:21.583 --> 00:07:24.458
didn\'t take care of these
people, there was no MediCal,
00:07:24.541 --> 00:07:30.625
there was no, uh, nothing for,
uh, to pay for these people,
00:07:30.791 --> 00:07:32.708
so they-they came
to the county hospital.
00:07:33.166 --> 00:07:35.708
BENKER: And this one
resident in order to make the
00:07:35.791 --> 00:07:39.250
process go faster, would
have a woman get on the table.
00:07:39.791 --> 00:07:43.500
And simultaneously one resident,
00:07:43.583 --> 00:07:46.541
standing on either side
of the table would be examining
00:07:46.625 --> 00:07:47.500
the left breast,
00:07:47.583 --> 00:07:49.416
another would be
examining the right breast,
00:07:49.500 --> 00:07:53.250
a third resident would be doing
a vaginal exam and a fourth one
00:07:53.333 --> 00:07:55.916
would, would be writing down
the results and each person
00:07:56.000 --> 00:07:59.125
and team would, in,
in turn would call out..
00:07:59.208 --> 00:08:00.041
\"Left breast OK\",
00:08:00.125 --> 00:08:02.375
\"Right breast OK\",
you know, \"Vaginal exam\".
00:08:02.458 --> 00:08:03.833
\"Yeah, OK.\"
00:08:03.916 --> 00:08:07.875
And ummm, next,
next it was like, rape.
00:08:11.041 --> 00:08:12.333
BLANCHETTE: It was rushed.
00:08:12.416 --> 00:08:15.125
The, it was last minute
decision-making with a woman
00:08:15.208 --> 00:08:17.541
whose frightened because all
of a sudden she\'s told she\'s
00:08:17.625 --> 00:08:19.833
got to undergo major surgery.
00:08:19.916 --> 00:08:21.916
She\'s being wheeled down
in a gurney and they said,
00:08:22.000 --> 00:08:23.750
\"Look, you\'ve got to get a,
got to get a signature.
00:08:23.833 --> 00:08:25.500
We\'re gonna go in there
and do a tubal ligation.
00:08:25.583 --> 00:08:26.750
We\'ve got to
get a signature.\"
00:08:26.833 --> 00:08:28.125
That\'s, eh, you know, you know,
00:08:28.208 --> 00:08:29.791
so you just hand it
to her and just sign here.
00:08:29.875 --> 00:08:31.125
And she didn\'t even read it.
00:08:31.208 --> 00:08:32.916
She was just signing
because, you know,
00:08:33.000 --> 00:08:34.208
they\'re taking care of me.
00:08:34.291 --> 00:08:36.541
You know, they\'re
worried about my baby\'s status.
00:08:36.625 --> 00:08:38.708
Ummm, you know,
so it was a process.
00:08:38.791 --> 00:08:42.000
CONSUELO: I just see
people behind, uh, passing.
00:08:42.083 --> 00:08:44.041
And I said \"When are
they going to take me?
00:08:44.125 --> 00:08:45.208
When are they
going to take me?\"
00:08:45.291 --> 00:08:49.000
And this lady came
up to me and uh, I just,
00:08:49.083 --> 00:08:50.791
I don\'t remember
seeing her face,
00:08:50.875 --> 00:08:52.625
I just remember
her voice telling me
00:08:52.708 --> 00:08:54.958
\"jita, you better sign
those papers or your,
00:08:55.041 --> 00:08:56.791
your baby probably
could die, here.\"
00:09:03.250 --> 00:09:06.333
♪ ♪
00:09:24.833 --> 00:09:29.166
♪ MAN: We hold each other tight,
in the hope of... ♪♪
00:09:49.708 --> 00:09:52.666
(speaking in Spanish)
00:09:55.083 --> 00:09:57.791
These beans have cheese.
00:09:57.875 --> 00:09:59.958
Everybody eats cheese?
00:10:02.708 --> 00:10:06.125
I had plans to
have a lot of kids.
00:10:06.208 --> 00:10:07.833
Like my sister says
00:10:07.916 --> 00:10:09.750
\"I don\'t know how
you handle all the kids.\"
00:10:09.833 --> 00:10:12.041
I could babysit, I could
cook a big pot of food and,
00:10:12.125 --> 00:10:14.416
that was my plan.
00:10:14.833 --> 00:10:17.666
And, I met him
downtown in a movie.
00:10:17.750 --> 00:10:19.125
We were not even
watching the show,
00:10:19.208 --> 00:10:20.958
we was watching each other.
00:10:21.041 --> 00:10:22.916
That\'s why I don\'t remember it.
00:10:23.083 --> 00:10:25.375
(laughter).
00:10:37.041 --> 00:10:39.708
ROSENFELD: If you look
at practices of Germany.
00:10:39.791 --> 00:10:44.083
That was the first thing
they did was they sterilized
00:10:44.166 --> 00:10:46.916
unwanted Jews, gypsies.
00:10:48.875 --> 00:10:52.208
My Grandfather who
was an Orthodox rabbi,
00:10:52.291 --> 00:10:54.791
who was a Torah scholar.
00:10:54.875 --> 00:10:57.625
And I was always
told to talk up if I didn\'t
00:10:57.708 --> 00:11:00.166
feel something was right.
00:11:02.166 --> 00:11:05.958
Just after work, I
would spend an hour typing
00:11:06.041 --> 00:11:10.125
up these letters and, trying
to explain what was going on.
00:11:11.041 --> 00:11:16.208
December 14th, 1974,
Congress of Racial Equality...
00:11:16.583 --> 00:11:19.500
Robert Olson,
Office of Family Planning.
00:11:19.708 --> 00:11:22.916
Little has been done, so far,
to alleviate these atrocities...
00:11:23.041 --> 00:11:26.041
Ms. Helen Gurley Brown,
editor Cosmopolitan,
00:11:26.125 --> 00:11:28.000
very few doctors are
willing to put pressure on
00:11:28.083 --> 00:11:30.541
the hospitals to
apply proper safe cause.
00:11:30.833 --> 00:11:32.750
Rev. Jesse L. Jackson,
00:11:32.833 --> 00:11:35.416
Protect indigent women
from those doctors who would
00:11:35.500 --> 00:11:38.416
coerce them into a
sterilization operation.
00:11:41.666 --> 00:11:44.208
♪ ♪
00:11:47.583 --> 00:11:50.750
ANTONIA: There\'s no way that
any other person on the outside
00:11:50.833 --> 00:11:52.666
would have known of these facts.
00:11:52.750 --> 00:11:56.875
He will tell you that he went
to many places seeking anyone
00:11:56.958 --> 00:11:58.666
to listen to them.
00:11:58.750 --> 00:12:02.000
And he finally ended up
in the legal aide office of
00:12:02.083 --> 00:12:04.416
Model Cities on Brooklyn Ave
00:12:04.500 --> 00:12:07.458
and it just so
happens that we listened.
00:12:12.125 --> 00:12:14.958
I\'m a kid out of east LA.
00:12:15.375 --> 00:12:18.833
I had just graduated,
from the UCLA School of Law,
00:12:18.916 --> 00:12:21.625
and I started working at
an organization called the
00:12:21.708 --> 00:12:24.416
Center for Law & Poverty.
00:12:25.458 --> 00:12:28.166
And I remember
one day Dr. Rosenfeld
00:12:28.666 --> 00:12:30.833
with all his curly hair coming
00:12:30.916 --> 00:12:36.791
in stating that he was
a doctor at LA county/USC
00:12:37.458 --> 00:12:42.291
and that he had
information that indicated that
00:12:42.375 --> 00:12:45.125
doctors were sterilizing women,
00:12:45.208 --> 00:12:47.583
predominantly
Latina Spanish speaking
00:12:47.666 --> 00:12:49.708
women without their consent.
00:12:51.125 --> 00:12:55.958
I went thru the tubal
sterilization book at LA County
00:12:57.333 --> 00:13:00.083
and then asked the woman
who was in charge medical
00:13:00.166 --> 00:13:03.125
records to pull up the charts.
00:13:06.625 --> 00:13:10.083
ANTONIA: All I remember is these
boxes with hundreds of files.
00:13:11.791 --> 00:13:14.208
Hundreds of files.
00:13:18.375 --> 00:13:21.000
♪ ♪
00:13:23.333 --> 00:13:24.773
RADIO DJ:
(inaudible) good afternoon,
00:13:24.833 --> 00:13:26.666
chatter on the radio...
00:13:30.375 --> 00:13:33.375
ANTONIA: I must have spent
months literally I used to
00:13:33.458 --> 00:13:38.833
have a little Datsun, gold
Datsun, driving up and down
00:13:38.916 --> 00:13:42.208
Boyle Heights, and
Lincoln Heights, East LA,
00:13:42.291 --> 00:13:44.708
trying to find these women.
00:13:44.916 --> 00:13:47.125
All we had was hospital records.
00:13:49.166 --> 00:13:50.166
Nothing else.
00:13:50.250 --> 00:13:53.958
And many of the women,
the statute of limitations,
00:13:54.041 --> 00:13:56.208
the time to file had expired.
00:13:56.541 --> 00:13:59.791
There were many,
many more women.
00:14:25.666 --> 00:14:27.416
They say \"Oh boy!\"
00:14:30.791 --> 00:14:33.750
Everywhere I
would go with my kids.
00:14:33.833 --> 00:14:35.353
When I started
taking them to school...
00:16:06.500 --> 00:16:07.708
ANTONIA: Some of
them didn\'t know anything.
00:16:07.791 --> 00:16:10.958
Some of them signed
right in the midst of labor.
00:16:11.250 --> 00:16:14.416
Some of them don\'t even remember
signing and the scribbling.
00:16:15.166 --> 00:16:19.291
Umm, and so I, eh, here
is this young lawyer going
00:16:19.375 --> 00:16:21.958
into somebody\'s home
and for first time,
00:16:22.041 --> 00:16:24.916
telling them, \"Do you know
you\'ve been sterilized?\"
00:16:33.458 --> 00:16:36.458
♪ ♪
00:16:41.708 --> 00:16:44.000
RICARDO: Chicanos
and Latinos have worked hard
00:16:44.083 --> 00:16:45.875
to earn their future.
00:16:45.958 --> 00:16:48.625
For all of us,
the future is now.
00:16:52.458 --> 00:16:55.708
♪ ♪
00:17:05.083 --> 00:17:07.750
♪ ♪
00:17:07.916 --> 00:17:09.750
CAROL: My mom does
not speak English.
00:17:09.833 --> 00:17:12.375
She understands some.
00:17:12.458 --> 00:17:16.625
When we were growing up no
matter where we went there
00:17:16.708 --> 00:17:19.791
was always one of 5 of
us to translate for my mom.
00:17:22.166 --> 00:17:23.958
We\'d get on the bus
and go to the hospital;
00:17:24.041 --> 00:17:26.500
we\'d get on the
bus and go downtown.
00:17:33.000 --> 00:17:35.375
♪ ♪
00:17:41.250 --> 00:17:42.500
♪ ♪
00:17:42.666 --> 00:17:44.666
When I got my car,
I had a Mustang.
00:17:44.750 --> 00:17:46.666
And I\'d take my
mom and I\'d tell her,
00:17:46.750 --> 00:17:48.150
\"We\'re going to go
cruising ok mom?\"
00:18:03.333 --> 00:18:04.666
CAROL: We\'d do the
cruise around Whittier,
00:18:04.750 --> 00:18:07.375
we\'d do the one
or two slow cruises,
00:18:07.458 --> 00:18:09.333
they had the low riders
on the Friday nights
00:18:09.416 --> 00:18:10.625
and the Saturday nights.
00:18:13.875 --> 00:18:17.333
♪ MAN: There\'s a pretty
little girl cruising... ♪♪
00:19:31.916 --> 00:19:36.416
ROSENFELD: These are various
conversations I did write down,
00:19:36.500 --> 00:19:39.541
when I would talk
to the other doctors.
00:19:41.958 --> 00:19:45.291
Most people wouldn\'t believe it
unless they heard it directly,
00:19:45.500 --> 00:19:48.958
so I went around with
a couple of investigative
00:19:49.041 --> 00:19:52.416
reporters from the \"LA Times\".
00:19:54.750 --> 00:19:59.000
\"One thing I picked up this
year was a whole new prejudice,
00:19:59.333 --> 00:20:02.208
I didn\'t have anything against
Mexicans when I came here.\"
00:20:03.500 --> 00:20:06.083
Umm, another doctor
said, Doctor Forester,
00:20:06.166 --> 00:20:08.666
\"Yeah, all they do is
screw, drink and drive
00:20:08.750 --> 00:20:13.083
\'59 Chevys with ruffles
on the top with baby boots.\"
00:20:17.541 --> 00:20:20.541
NEUMAN: I arrived
in Los Angeles.
00:20:20.625 --> 00:20:24.416
I had no clue
what Hispanic culture,
00:20:24.500 --> 00:20:27.125
language mores, anything!
00:20:27.708 --> 00:20:29.958
We met our junior
and senior residents.
00:20:31.208 --> 00:20:35.666
We had approximately an hour
orientation and they said \"Go!\"
00:20:37.750 --> 00:20:40.500
Patient interaction was a
little more difficult, for me.
00:21:11.000 --> 00:21:12.625
CONSUELO: If you speak English,
they treat you one way.
00:21:12.708 --> 00:21:14.791
You don\'t speak English,
they treat you another way.
00:21:15.166 --> 00:21:16.666
That\'s how I see it.
00:21:39.958 --> 00:21:42.166
ANTONIA: Finding
common words to explain,
00:21:42.250 --> 00:21:44.416
explain medical terms.
00:21:44.500 --> 00:21:47.083
Medical terms that
I myself did not understand
00:21:47.916 --> 00:21:49.250
and then explain to them.
00:21:49.333 --> 00:21:52.125
Because, you know, they,
they truly believed, I mean,
00:21:52.208 --> 00:21:55.666
it was a common misperception
coming from Mexico.
00:21:56.500 --> 00:21:58.180
BLANCHETTE: Yeah, the
\"tying of the tubes.\"
00:21:58.250 --> 00:22:01.041
The, you know, if-if
the patient spoke English
00:22:01.125 --> 00:22:03.875
you would say \"Well, what we,
we can do is tie your tubes\",
00:22:04.291 --> 00:22:06.791
you didn\'t say \"We\'re going
to \'tie and \'cut\' your tubes\"
00:22:06.875 --> 00:22:08.791
it was tie your
tubes, and so, that\'s,
00:22:08.875 --> 00:22:11.833
and, and still, some
people believe that wow, if
00:22:11.916 --> 00:22:14.208
they\'re tying my tubes,
they can come, untied.
00:22:15.000 --> 00:22:17.958
GLORIA: One of the women
shared with me that she had
00:22:18.041 --> 00:22:19.125
heard the term
00:22:19.208 --> 00:22:20.916
(speaking in Spanish)
00:22:21.000 --> 00:22:24.583
and so, she always thought
when they translated the word
00:22:24.666 --> 00:22:28.041
to her at the hospital
that it was a \"cleaning\",
00:22:28.125 --> 00:22:31.375
\"sterilization\" that it
was a cleaning of the womb
00:22:31.458 --> 00:22:32.125
or something.
00:22:32.208 --> 00:22:33.958
She understood it to be that.
00:23:49.583 --> 00:23:51.500
NARRATOR: The resolution of the
American Medical Association
00:23:51.583 --> 00:23:53.083
states that,
00:23:53.166 --> 00:23:55.083
An intelligent
recognition of the problems
00:23:55.166 --> 00:23:57.458
that relate to
human reproduction,
00:23:57.541 --> 00:24:00.083
including the need
for population control,
00:24:00.166 --> 00:24:02.083
is a matter of
responsible medical practice.
00:24:12.583 --> 00:24:15.125
Tubal ligation can be
accomplished either vaginally
00:24:15.208 --> 00:24:17.291
or abdominally.
00:24:17.375 --> 00:24:20.000
It has no effect on
menstruation or ovulation.
00:24:36.083 --> 00:24:37.458
REPORTER: The
nurseries are jammed,
00:24:37.541 --> 00:24:39.791
with newborn babies
and County USC officials
00:24:39.875 --> 00:24:41.750
predict they\'ll be
delivering twice as many
00:24:41.833 --> 00:24:43.958
babies this summer
as years past.
00:24:45.750 --> 00:24:48.333
BENKER: So, the
ideology is we\'re
00:24:48.416 --> 00:24:51.416
\"saving the planet by keeping
these people from reproducing
00:24:51.500 --> 00:24:53.291
any more than they are.\"
00:24:53.958 --> 00:24:55.625
♪ Pop, pop,
there\'s another pop, ♪
00:24:55.708 --> 00:24:56.750
♪ there\'s another pop, ♪
00:24:56.833 --> 00:24:59.291
♪ overpopulation it\'s
a tricky situation. ♪
00:24:59.791 --> 00:25:01.666
♪ Pop, pop,
there\'s another pop, ♪
00:25:01.750 --> 00:25:04.125
♪ over pop,
another baby boom, ♪
00:25:04.208 --> 00:25:06.041
♪ but there
isn\'t much room. ♪♪
00:25:07.541 --> 00:25:09.541
ELENA: The population
bomb was a call to arms to
00:25:09.625 --> 00:25:12.916
stop having so many children.
00:25:13.000 --> 00:25:15.208
The book had a huge
impact on the general public.
00:25:16.166 --> 00:25:18.666
It was really the impetus
for kind of creating the
00:25:18.750 --> 00:25:22.583
population control lobby
that was cemented in the 1970s
00:25:23.208 --> 00:25:26.208
and still exists to this day.
00:25:27.875 --> 00:25:32.333
PAUL: I am a doomsayer because
I do believe doom is coming.
00:25:32.791 --> 00:25:35.958
In the 1970s, the
world will undergo famines,
00:25:36.125 --> 00:25:38.000
hundreds of millions of
people are going to starve to
00:25:38.083 --> 00:25:41.250
death in spite of any crash
programs embarked upon now.
00:25:42.166 --> 00:25:44.458
PRESIDENT JOHNSON: The really
greatest challenge to the human
00:25:44.541 --> 00:25:48.750
family is the race between food
supply and population increase,
00:25:50.416 --> 00:25:52.250
that race,
tonight, is being lost.
00:25:53.500 --> 00:25:55.791
REPORTER: Donald Rumsfeld,
a White House counselor,
00:25:55.875 --> 00:25:58.041
said today, Washington
eventually will have to do
00:25:58.125 --> 00:26:00.875
something about this country\'s
rapidly growing population.
00:26:02.083 --> 00:26:05.041
For example, he said, it\'ll
have to decide about persuading
00:26:05.125 --> 00:26:08.083
or coercing its citizens
to have fewer children.
00:26:11.041 --> 00:26:14.291
JOE: When you talk about
family planning back in the 70s,
00:26:15.500 --> 00:26:19.750
it was a really big deal
and there were lots of lobbying
00:26:20.083 --> 00:26:24.416
interests non-profit
organizations that wanted to
00:26:24.500 --> 00:26:28.166
make sure that we had
population under control.
00:26:29.666 --> 00:26:31.416
REPORTER: President Nixon
signed a bill, today,
00:26:31.500 --> 00:26:34.083
setting up a commission
to study population growth
00:26:34.500 --> 00:26:36.125
in the United States.
00:26:36.208 --> 00:26:38.375
He said that it\'s a highly
explosive problem and he named
00:26:38.458 --> 00:26:41.458
John D Rockefeller 3rd of
New York to head the commission.
00:26:42.000 --> 00:26:43.708
ALEXANDRA: That\'s where
the money was coming from and
00:26:43.791 --> 00:26:47.250
there was a lot of it,
in the late 1960s early 70s,
00:26:47.458 --> 00:26:50.125
because the idea was
that this was really critical
00:26:51.000 --> 00:26:53.416
to progress in American society.
00:26:54.375 --> 00:26:59.041
That changing women\'s access to
reproductive health in the name
00:26:59.125 --> 00:27:03.458
of population planning or family
planning would benefit society.
00:27:16.583 --> 00:27:18.541
CONSUELO: Every time
they\'ll talk to you because
00:27:18.625 --> 00:27:20.291
you had 3 babies.
00:27:20.375 --> 00:27:22.166
And I said well I have
to talk to my husband,
00:27:22.250 --> 00:27:24.791
I have to discuss
this, we\'re not ready.
00:27:25.000 --> 00:27:27.083
I\'m, I was 22, 23.
00:27:27.750 --> 00:27:30.375
JOE: In its generalities,
it was a great idea.
00:27:30.458 --> 00:27:36.166
Uh, it provided a
service that, uh, people in,
00:27:36.250 --> 00:27:40.250
in the lower end of
the economic strata simply
00:27:40.333 --> 00:27:41.958
did not have before.
00:27:42.416 --> 00:27:45.958
It was a great idea and it
just shows you what can happen,
00:27:46.875 --> 00:27:52.166
the unintended consequences
of an unregulated flow of money.
00:27:54.291 --> 00:27:56.291
REPORTER: The first state
official arrived this morning
00:27:56.375 --> 00:27:59.208
to begin an investigation
of charges that arising out
00:27:59.291 --> 00:28:00.958
of the sterilization
of women on welfare.
00:28:01.166 --> 00:28:03.447
REPORTER 2: This baby boy
became a citizen one minute ago.
00:28:03.625 --> 00:28:05.625
His mother does not
have immigration papers.
00:28:05.958 --> 00:28:07.375
REPORTER 3: Save
taxpayers welfare money,
00:28:07.458 --> 00:28:08.875
told they should be sterilized.
00:28:08.958 --> 00:28:11.250
REPORTER 4: Almost 4 weeks
ago in Montgomery, Alabama,
00:28:11.625 --> 00:28:13.500
2 black sisters Minnie Relf,
00:28:13.583 --> 00:28:15.833
14 years old,
and Mary Alice Relf,
00:28:15.916 --> 00:28:17.833
12 years old were sterilized.
00:28:18.250 --> 00:28:20.410
They were operated on in a
clinic which gets money from
00:28:20.458 --> 00:28:22.500
the federal office of
economic opportunity.
00:28:23.416 --> 00:28:25.791
Later the children\'s mother
who was illiterate said she
00:28:25.875 --> 00:28:27.958
had put a mark on
a paper agreeing to
00:28:28.041 --> 00:28:30.208
something but not sterilization.
00:28:31.041 --> 00:28:33.791
BLANCHETTE: I remember,
vividly, talking to some of my,
00:28:33.875 --> 00:28:37.416
my buddies who were from
the south, you know, who said,
00:28:37.500 --> 00:28:38.625
\"Well in Mississippi,
00:28:38.708 --> 00:28:40.791
we\'d call it a
\'Mississippi Appendectomy\'.\"
00:28:41.208 --> 00:28:44.708
You know, women,
African American women would
00:28:44.791 --> 00:28:47.583
go into a Mississippi
hospital and then told that
00:28:47.666 --> 00:28:48.833
she had acute appendicitis,
00:28:48.916 --> 00:28:50.750
and come out
sterilized, you know.
00:28:50.916 --> 00:28:52.958
ANTONIA: It happened to,
to, to white poor people
00:28:53.041 --> 00:28:54.291
from Appalachia.
00:28:54.375 --> 00:28:56.291
It happened to
poor black people.
00:28:56.375 --> 00:28:58.291
It happened to
poor Latino peoples.
00:28:58.375 --> 00:29:00.458
It was, it was that sense of,
00:29:00.541 --> 00:29:04.333
that these poor people
were having too many babies.
00:29:14.250 --> 00:29:17.375
♪ ♪
00:29:26.208 --> 00:29:29.833
♪ ♪
00:29:33.250 --> 00:29:35.916
BENKER: My group
of students were assigned
00:29:36.000 --> 00:29:38.625
to the obstetrics rotation.
00:29:40.041 --> 00:29:42.958
So we all had our little
white coats and our stethoscopes
00:29:43.041 --> 00:29:44.583
and Dr. Quilligan came out,
00:29:44.666 --> 00:29:47.333
he was, he had been
brought from Yale to
00:29:47.416 --> 00:29:49.541
head this new women\'s hospital,
00:29:49.625 --> 00:29:52.625
and came out and
took us on a little tour,
00:29:53.416 --> 00:29:56.958
and said in a very proud
way that they had just
00:29:57.041 --> 00:30:00.541
gotten this big grant to
see how low they could cut the
00:30:00.625 --> 00:30:05.250
birth rate of the negro/
Mexican population and
00:30:05.333 --> 00:30:07.750
we were just floored.
00:30:07.958 --> 00:30:10.125
I mean we were just...
00:30:10.625 --> 00:30:13.083
QUILLIGAN: I think that\'s
a ridiculous assertation,
00:30:13.291 --> 00:30:16.750
I, you know, I, I don\'t
know anybody that was pushing
00:30:16.833 --> 00:30:19.916
family planning,
particularly on any, at,
00:30:20.000 --> 00:30:21.500
at least to the
best of my knowledge,
00:30:21.583 --> 00:30:24.208
on any particular group
or any particular population.
00:30:24.875 --> 00:30:27.375
I think every woman deserves
a right to make a choice.
00:30:28.791 --> 00:30:31.666
ROSENFELD: Dr. Quilligan
was extremely prominent in
00:30:31.750 --> 00:30:35.750
the field, you know,
probably the top two or three
00:30:35.833 --> 00:30:39.250
highly regarded
chiefs of obstetrics and
00:30:39.333 --> 00:30:41.375
gynecology in the United States.
00:30:41.666 --> 00:30:45.833
He came from Yale
and LA County, uh,
00:30:45.916 --> 00:30:48.041
USC was considered the best,
00:30:48.625 --> 00:30:51.583
uh, training
program at that time.
00:30:54.125 --> 00:30:57.791
QUILLIGAN: One of the things
we wanted to do was to institute
00:30:57.875 --> 00:31:00.916
fetal monitoring,
which was brand new then,
00:31:01.000 --> 00:31:05.500
and see if we couldn\'t, uh,
increase the safety of the baby,
00:31:06.291 --> 00:31:08.250
uh, during the labor process.
00:31:10.666 --> 00:31:13.583
BLANCHETTE: He set an
ethical standard that our,
00:31:13.666 --> 00:31:16.500
our responsibility was
to take care of the patient.
00:31:19.583 --> 00:31:22.791
Dr. Quilligan was, you know,
revered and loved and respected,
00:31:23.250 --> 00:31:27.083
uh, outstanding, uh, leader
and remains so, uh, today,
00:31:27.500 --> 00:31:30.666
I mean we all, you know,
we all revered the \"Q\".
00:31:31.708 --> 00:31:34.000
I don\'t think there\'s one
resident who went through that
00:31:34.083 --> 00:31:37.000
program while he was the
chair that didn\'t love that man.
00:31:39.458 --> 00:31:41.916
QUILLIGAN: Dr.
Edward Quilligan at,
00:31:42.000 --> 00:31:46.375
uh, Los Angeles County Hospital
after I complained to him,
00:31:47.291 --> 00:31:49.208
this would be the third time.
00:31:50.000 --> 00:31:52.333
QUILLIGAN: I wasn\'t there
for each one of them.
00:31:52.416 --> 00:31:55.708
I doubt it, seriously, if they
were forced into sterilization.
00:31:56.708 --> 00:31:59.416
Uhhh, the doctors who
were there told me that,
00:31:59.500 --> 00:32:01.833
that they weren\'t,
I believe them.
00:32:02.375 --> 00:32:04.666
ROSENFELD: Before went
into Dr. Quilligan\'s office,
00:32:04.750 --> 00:32:08.041
I was really nervous;
and I showed him charts,
00:32:08.500 --> 00:32:10.291
I went up and I
showed him charts.
00:32:10.458 --> 00:32:13.583
I said \"See this woman
never desired sterilization.\"
00:32:14.458 --> 00:32:17.291
And then there\'s a note \"She
still refuses sterilization.\"
00:32:18.625 --> 00:32:20.500
And then by the fourth note
00:32:20.583 --> 00:32:22.708
\"The patient
agrees to sterilization.\"
00:32:22.791 --> 00:32:25.083
So there was no, you know,
I brought him the charts.
00:32:25.541 --> 00:32:27.625
I said, \"here are the charts.\"
00:32:29.833 --> 00:32:35.583
QUILLIGAN: He brought
up a problem and, um,
00:32:35.666 --> 00:32:38.958
we looked into
the problem, uh, I,
00:32:39.041 --> 00:32:41.125
I have no idea what
his motivations are.
00:32:43.666 --> 00:32:45.541
BLANCHETTE: Dr. Quilligan
wouldn\'t have known what was
00:32:45.625 --> 00:32:46.666
going on down there.
00:32:46.750 --> 00:32:49.291
Because, you know, uhh,
he\'s upstairs, you know,
00:32:49.375 --> 00:32:51.958
and his chief residents
are running the service
00:32:52.041 --> 00:32:53.125
and that\'s uh.
00:32:53.208 --> 00:32:56.208
So we, as residents were
the ones that were responsible,
00:32:56.291 --> 00:32:59.208
you know, to, to take
care of these patients.
00:32:59.291 --> 00:33:00.625
ROSENFELD: Cause
he could have stopped it
00:33:00.708 --> 00:33:01.500
completely after that.
00:33:01.583 --> 00:33:04.750
He could have, you know,
all you have to do is to tell
00:33:04.833 --> 00:33:08.750
the resident, \"OK, if, if
I catch you doing this one time,
00:33:09.375 --> 00:33:11.375
You\'ll be thrown
out of the program.\"
00:33:11.458 --> 00:33:13.500
It would have
never happened, again.
00:33:13.583 --> 00:33:15.291
But it kept happening.
00:33:16.791 --> 00:33:19.500
ANTONIA: Dr. Quilligan was the
model of the medical profession.
00:33:20.000 --> 00:33:22.541
It\'s someone that you would
have the faith and the trust in.
00:33:23.166 --> 00:33:26.250
What I remember about
him very precise, very cold.
00:33:27.375 --> 00:33:30.666
And very indignant that
we would be challenging his
00:33:30.750 --> 00:33:33.500
medical judgment, and
particularly this, you know,
00:33:33.583 --> 00:33:36.125
27 young/old lawyer
that he probably thought,
00:33:36.208 --> 00:33:38.291
I didn\'t know what
the hell I was doing.
00:34:23.125 --> 00:34:26.000
CARLOS: I first met
Antonia in my office upstairs.
00:34:27.333 --> 00:34:29.416
And she asked me
what would the effect of
00:34:29.500 --> 00:34:32.208
these sterilizations would be.
00:34:32.875 --> 00:34:33.916
And I answered on the phone,
00:34:34.000 --> 00:34:35.560
\"I think that it
would be very serious.\"
00:34:36.083 --> 00:34:37.666
About 90% of them
come from rural areas.
00:34:38.250 --> 00:34:40.875
And they come from very
large families and it was highly
00:34:40.958 --> 00:34:43.791
likely that their,
that their value on having
00:34:43.875 --> 00:34:45.625
children would be very high.
00:34:46.291 --> 00:34:48.875
And so therefore when that
opportunity was disrupted by
00:34:48.958 --> 00:34:52.166
the sterilizations
that they would suffer,
00:34:52.250 --> 00:34:53.583
suffer grievously.
00:34:54.291 --> 00:34:56.833
And so for the next 6 months
or so I worked on the case.
00:34:58.041 --> 00:34:59.250
I did interviews.
00:35:18.916 --> 00:35:21.750
PATRICIA: And the note
says \"is not interested
00:35:21.833 --> 00:35:24.375
in participating
in the lawsuit,\"
00:35:24.458 --> 00:35:26.791
she says that she just
wants to forget about it.
00:35:28.250 --> 00:35:30.916
We met with
Dr. Bernard Rosenfeld;
00:35:31.000 --> 00:35:32.833
um, we use, we went to his home.
00:35:33.333 --> 00:35:37.541
And he had some sheets of
paper that he gave us with a
00:35:37.625 --> 00:35:40.833
name of a woman, an address, and
00:35:40.916 --> 00:35:44.708
a couple of sentences
about a situa,
00:35:44.791 --> 00:35:48.083
a situation or
circumstances that had happened.
00:35:51.291 --> 00:35:53.541
Their homes were not,
they weren\'t extravagant,
00:35:53.875 --> 00:35:56.291
they were basic, they were
very gracious to let us in,
00:35:56.791 --> 00:35:58.583
even though we were strangers.
00:36:00.583 --> 00:36:04.083
They felt like their husbands
would no longer want them,
00:36:04.958 --> 00:36:09.000
because they would be muleres
de la calle, in other words,
00:36:09.083 --> 00:36:10.666
they would be
\"Women of the street\"
00:36:11.291 --> 00:36:13.250
that could have
relations with anybody,
00:36:13.583 --> 00:36:15.303
because they couldn\'t
have children anymore.
00:36:16.000 --> 00:36:19.083
ANTONIA: I remember that
while we were sitting in, in
00:36:19.166 --> 00:36:22.458
the living room, and I was
explaining and the husband
00:36:22.541 --> 00:36:26.041
came in and looked at this
strange woman in his house,
00:36:26.125 --> 00:36:28.875
and she changed the subject.
00:36:29.458 --> 00:36:32.833
And then whispered to me
that I was not to say anything.
00:36:34.375 --> 00:36:36.833
And so trying to sort
of change the conversation and
00:36:36.916 --> 00:36:39.416
exit from the home in
00:36:39.500 --> 00:36:42.750
a way that I did
not put her her at risk.
00:38:16.166 --> 00:38:19.083
♪ ♪
00:38:19.291 --> 00:38:21.416
ANTONIA: It\'s one of the most
traumatic experiences for me.
00:38:21.500 --> 00:38:23.583
You know, having to
deliver this terrible news.
00:38:23.666 --> 00:38:26.083
And then having to
explain to them that the reason
00:38:26.166 --> 00:38:28.791
I am there telling them
this is because I want them
00:38:28.875 --> 00:38:32.750
to consider participating in
a lawsuit to stop the practice.
00:38:51.125 --> 00:38:51.916
CHARLES: They
rearrange the room?
00:38:52.291 --> 00:38:53.750
WOMAN: Yea, somebody\'s keys
is here so they know where
00:38:53.833 --> 00:38:56.583
they\'re at here.
00:38:57.875 --> 00:39:00.541
CHARLES: I worked for
the Los Angeles Center
00:39:00.625 --> 00:39:02.000
for Law and Justice,
00:39:02.083 --> 00:39:05.291
I was the senior attorney,
and when we filed the lawsuit
00:39:05.375 --> 00:39:08.166
I was 29 years old.
00:39:09.958 --> 00:39:12.750
ANTONIA: It took us about a year
and a half to prepare the case.
00:39:14.250 --> 00:39:17.291
And you know, in retrospect,
it was a-a Goliath and David.
00:39:18.000 --> 00:39:20.333
You have the County
with all its resources,
00:39:20.416 --> 00:39:22.916
and you have Charlie and Me.
00:39:25.375 --> 00:39:29.000
And he\'s still practicing
law, but he\'s legally blind.
00:39:30.833 --> 00:39:33.416
CHARLES: Yeah, I was 19
when I initially became ill.
00:39:35.916 --> 00:39:39.083
Just woke up one day with
blurred vision and red eyes
00:39:39.625 --> 00:39:44.041
and ummm, then within
a week I was completely blind.
00:39:47.041 --> 00:39:50.541
Well my grandfather
worked as a farm worker,
00:39:50.708 --> 00:39:53.083
my father was a shoe repairman.
00:39:55.833 --> 00:39:58.583
Growing up in Southern
California in the 50s,
00:39:58.666 --> 00:40:01.125
was a time where the teachers,
00:40:01.208 --> 00:40:04.291
they were narrow-minded
and discriminated a lot.
00:40:06.125 --> 00:40:09.291
They would punish
Mexican-American students more
00:40:09.375 --> 00:40:11.708
than they would white students.
00:40:11.791 --> 00:40:15.916
They\'d put the Chicano
students in lower classes and,
00:40:16.333 --> 00:40:19.500
that all left a
scar in, on me \'cause it,
00:40:19.583 --> 00:40:22.125
taught me what
discrimination was about.
00:40:23.541 --> 00:40:25.125
PROTESTOR: When a kid walks
into a probation officer he
00:40:25.208 --> 00:40:28.541
automatically assumes the
kid takes narcotics, he\'s dirty,
00:40:28.958 --> 00:40:31.000
he\'s lazy, he don\'t
wanna work, he\'s a criminal.
00:40:31.541 --> 00:40:33.583
Automatically, just
because he\'s a Chicano!
00:40:33.916 --> 00:40:35.500
WOMAN: The people
that are here in our town,
00:40:35.583 --> 00:40:37.458
they don\'t belong here
and I wish they\'d all go back
00:40:37.541 --> 00:40:38.916
to where they came from.
00:40:39.000 --> 00:40:41.160
WOMAN 2: He says \"We don\'t
like your kind around here.\"
00:40:41.208 --> 00:40:42.291
INTERVIEWER: He told
your little boy?
00:40:42.375 --> 00:40:43.416
WOMAN: He told
my little boy that!
00:40:43.500 --> 00:40:44.666
You know, like I told him,
what\'s the matter, I said,
00:40:44.750 --> 00:40:46.125
are you just
prejudiced against Mexicans?
00:40:46.208 --> 00:40:48.208
And he said \"We don\'t
like your kind around here.\"
00:40:51.125 --> 00:40:52.041
WOMAN 3: We have
to do something, now,
00:40:52.125 --> 00:40:54.750
anything is better than
just sitting back and saying
00:40:54.833 --> 00:40:57.041
\"Well, don\'t do this,
don\'t do that!\"
00:40:58.750 --> 00:41:01.541
ANTONIA: It was just the
beginning of the emergence of
00:41:01.625 --> 00:41:05.208
the civil rights movement
in the Latino Community.
00:41:06.250 --> 00:41:09.333
CONSUELO: What make me so mad,
at that time, in the schools,
00:41:10.625 --> 00:41:11.708
there\'s kids they come,
00:41:11.791 --> 00:41:13.375
they\'re 11-12 years old
from Mexico,
00:41:13.458 --> 00:41:15.375
they\'re very smart,
and they treat them like,
00:41:18.000 --> 00:41:21.416
I was always fighting
for the kids, you know.
00:41:23.791 --> 00:41:26.125
CAROL: During that
time, when it was,
00:41:26.208 --> 00:41:29.708
a lot of the Latino movements
that were starting to happen.
00:41:29.791 --> 00:41:33.000
Being in east LA and
having my mom as my back up,
00:41:33.958 --> 00:41:35.750
everybody knew, we were
00:41:35.833 --> 00:41:39.666
Juan Hurtado\'s
kids, they knew that
00:41:39.750 --> 00:41:42.541
\"Those kids you
don\'t mess with.\"
00:41:42.625 --> 00:41:44.708
She didn\'t take
anything from anybody,
00:41:44.791 --> 00:41:46.791
even though she
didn\'t speak the language,
00:41:46.875 --> 00:41:48.875
and she always told us
\"You keep fighting for what you
00:41:48.958 --> 00:41:51.375
want, you don\'t
let anybody tell you.\"
00:42:24.750 --> 00:42:27.125
FRANK CRUZ: When I
was a reporter at ABC,
00:42:27.208 --> 00:42:30.750
and at NBC from the early 70s,
00:42:30.833 --> 00:42:33.375
a lot of the same
arguments that I am hearing now,
00:42:33.458 --> 00:42:35.208
I was hearing then.
00:42:35.291 --> 00:42:38.916
That undocumented workers
are burdens on the society,
00:42:39.250 --> 00:42:42.708
that they\'re drains on system,
that they are here to have
00:42:42.791 --> 00:42:44.666
children that they\'re
here to overpopulate.
00:42:47.833 --> 00:42:51.666
PATRICIA: We began to work to
get that word out about what
00:42:51.750 --> 00:42:55.333
was going on with respect to
immigration and sterilization.
00:42:58.375 --> 00:43:00.875
GLORIA: We were talking
about abortion rights,
00:43:00.958 --> 00:43:03.750
about all of the issues
of feminism at that time.
00:43:04.250 --> 00:43:08.375
Just the idea that somebody
could be forcibly sterilized
00:43:08.458 --> 00:43:11.000
like, seemed like something
out of a mental institution
00:43:11.083 --> 00:43:12.583
out of the 1920s.
00:43:12.791 --> 00:43:15.416
ANTONIA: So you\'re coming
into and environment where
00:43:15.500 --> 00:43:18.250
you\'re literally, you know,
challenging the status quo.
00:43:19.125 --> 00:43:24.833
And by a group of powerless poor
women coming out of the barrio.
00:43:46.541 --> 00:43:48.333
PATRICIA: We felt that
that story needed to get out,
00:43:48.416 --> 00:43:50.250
it needed to be exposed.
00:43:50.333 --> 00:43:52.625
We even organized uh,
a demonstration at
00:43:52.708 --> 00:43:55.583
County USC Medical Center
and we had a rally at the
00:43:55.666 --> 00:43:57.666
park across the street.
00:43:57.750 --> 00:44:03.041
We had swat teams on
the roof with guns, you know,
00:44:03.708 --> 00:44:07.500
like this and also
helicopters flying around.
00:44:13.583 --> 00:44:15.500
GLORIA: Comision Femenil
were group of very
00:44:15.583 --> 00:44:17.125
active young women.
00:44:17.208 --> 00:44:20.250
We were all potential,
um, victims of forced
00:44:20.333 --> 00:44:21.791
sterilizations.
00:44:25.833 --> 00:44:28.583
The Chicano movement,
unfortunately was all led
00:44:28.666 --> 00:44:32.750
by men and very, very much
a very sexist kind of approach.
00:44:33.458 --> 00:44:36.666
So when we raised these
issues to many of our brothers
00:44:36.750 --> 00:44:39.000
in, in the Chicano movement,
it was always considered a
00:44:39.083 --> 00:44:41.541
secondary issue, which
was really an angering.
00:44:41.625 --> 00:44:44.833
I mean we were
their workers as well.
00:44:50.083 --> 00:44:52.916
PATRICIA: We felt it
was very important to create
00:44:53.000 --> 00:44:54.250
the waiting period.
00:44:54.333 --> 00:44:57.083
72 hours seems a
reasonable amount of time.
00:44:57.166 --> 00:44:59.916
3 days to be able
to think about, uh,
00:45:00.000 --> 00:45:02.166
a life changing experience.
00:45:02.250 --> 00:45:04.333
GLORIA: Because we wanted
to make sure that everyone had
00:45:04.416 --> 00:45:06.375
truly informed consent.
00:45:06.458 --> 00:45:09.416
This was totally
offensive to white feminists.
00:45:09.916 --> 00:45:13.250
The feminists wanted
sterilization upon demand.
00:45:13.708 --> 00:45:16.416
They basically opposed
our-our waiting period.
00:45:17.583 --> 00:45:20.833
They weren\'t really taking
into account that if you\'re
00:45:20.916 --> 00:45:24.041
Spanish speaking or if you
don\'t speak English how you
00:45:24.125 --> 00:45:26.416
were being
denied a right totally.
00:45:28.625 --> 00:45:31.625
CLAUDIA: That\'s the
year of Roe v. Wade.
00:45:31.708 --> 00:45:35.541
That\'s the year that women
are beginning strongly to ask
00:45:35.625 --> 00:45:39.166
questions about their
entire reproductive lives.
00:45:40.208 --> 00:45:42.666
But I don\'t think people
had thought of coercive
00:45:42.750 --> 00:45:45.125
sterilization as
part of the picture.
00:45:48.875 --> 00:45:51.916
ANTONIA: I didn\'t care whether
they agreed with it, or not.
00:45:52.000 --> 00:45:54.583
I, I you know, I was
not there to please them.
00:45:55.250 --> 00:45:59.291
I was there about protecting
the rights of poor women,
00:45:59.375 --> 00:46:03.041
who under very vulnerable
circumstances were being abused.
00:46:05.750 --> 00:46:08.250
ELENA: A woman should be
able to decide to terminate her
00:46:08.333 --> 00:46:12.250
child bearing or to
also have the resources to have
00:46:12.333 --> 00:46:14.416
as many children as she wanted.
00:46:14.500 --> 00:46:19.041
So, in this way Chicana
feminists activists really
00:46:19.125 --> 00:46:22.750
redefined reproductive
politics during the 1970s.
00:46:24.583 --> 00:46:28.291
♪ ♪
00:46:37.166 --> 00:46:39.833
(speaking in Spanish)
00:47:07.708 --> 00:47:10.791
(speaking in Spanish)
00:47:10.875 --> 00:47:12.355
WOMAN: You don\'t
want my pink glasses?
00:47:40.541 --> 00:47:42.458
ORENCIO: This
is all news to me.
00:48:08.625 --> 00:48:12.125
ORENCIO: I never knew
what they did to my mom.
00:48:12.208 --> 00:48:14.791
Which is probably
good because if, you know,
00:48:14.875 --> 00:48:17.291
the kind of person that
I used to be, you know,
00:48:17.375 --> 00:48:19.250
I definitely woul,
would have done something
00:48:19.333 --> 00:48:20.333
about it, you know?
00:48:20.375 --> 00:48:21.375
You know, I would have probably
00:48:21.458 --> 00:48:22.583
hurt the other person, you know?
00:48:22.666 --> 00:48:25.333
You hurt the person who, who
did that to my mom, you know?
00:48:27.750 --> 00:48:30.708
REPORTER: Not too long ago,
Dolores Madrigal considered her
00:48:30.791 --> 00:48:34.916
life a fairytale after living
in Los Angeles for 6 years,
00:48:35.000 --> 00:48:37.416
she rediscovered her
childhood sweetheart.
00:48:43.041 --> 00:48:46.208
ORENCIO: Wow, that\'s
amazing, right there.
00:48:47.833 --> 00:48:50.125
REPORTER: That\'s when her
life became a nightmare.
00:48:53.166 --> 00:48:55.541
Several weeks later they
learned that the operation had
00:48:55.625 --> 00:48:58.166
been a permanent sterilization.
00:49:03.958 --> 00:49:06.916
ANTONIA: You know, it,
it was a slow process of
00:49:07.000 --> 00:49:09.875
convincing these women
that this was done to them.
00:49:10.458 --> 00:49:13.625
Then to convince
them to start thinking about
00:49:13.708 --> 00:49:15.791
being part of the case.
00:49:15.875 --> 00:49:18.208
That would be very public.
00:49:18.291 --> 00:49:20.916
That would put them in
a very vulnerable situation.
00:49:22.416 --> 00:49:25.208
And I really felt that
I had been given the tools
00:49:25.291 --> 00:49:27.291
of having gone to school,
00:49:27.375 --> 00:49:30.916
having obtained
a skill, being a lawyer.
00:49:31.250 --> 00:49:34.583
I was like their vehicle
for righting what had
00:49:34.666 --> 00:49:36.583
been done to them.
00:49:37.208 --> 00:49:39.708
I worked so hard for
them to have confidence in
00:49:39.791 --> 00:49:41.958
me and trust in me.
00:49:42.041 --> 00:49:48.041
We are suing HEW for
uh, non-compliance or
00:49:48.125 --> 00:49:52.041
non-enforcement, non-monitoring
of the sterilization
00:49:52.125 --> 00:49:56.875
regulations, also the
consent forms in Spanish at a,
00:49:56.958 --> 00:50:01.000
and at a reading level that
an individual can understand.
00:50:01.791 --> 00:50:03.750
REPORTER: The group is also
seeking damages and there\'s
00:50:03.833 --> 00:50:07.708
a possibility that criminal
charges will be filed later.
00:50:08.291 --> 00:50:11.125
Felicia Jeter, KNBC
news at the Los Angeles...
00:50:11.291 --> 00:50:13.375
CONSUELO: Honestly,
deep inside,
00:50:13.458 --> 00:50:15.416
I didn\'t thought she was
gonna get anything accomplished
00:50:15.500 --> 00:50:18.625
but I said,
it doesn\'t harm to try.
00:50:19.458 --> 00:50:22.166
And I was shocked when,
when she did everything.
00:50:22.583 --> 00:50:23.583
Because she was young,
00:50:23.625 --> 00:50:25.958
she had, I think
it was her first year.
00:50:40.250 --> 00:50:41.583
CONSUELO: I said,
well I don\'t have the time,
00:50:41.666 --> 00:50:43.333
the kids are small and.
00:50:43.416 --> 00:50:46.333
But I said I\'ll find the
time to help other people
00:50:46.416 --> 00:50:48.625
because what they did to
me, they shouldn\'t do it.
00:50:48.916 --> 00:50:50.041
They should never do it.
00:50:50.125 --> 00:50:52.083
No matter if the
welfare is supporting them,
00:50:52.166 --> 00:50:53.541
no matter if they\'re in MediCal,
00:50:53.625 --> 00:50:55.125
I don\'t care that\'s
one of the right,
00:50:55.208 --> 00:50:58.291
personal rights that we,
as a woman, have to defend.
00:51:02.375 --> 00:51:05.250
♪ ♪
00:51:12.541 --> 00:51:14.833
ANTONIA: Most people
believe that if you are Chicano,
00:51:14.916 --> 00:51:17.166
of Mexican descent,
that you are undocumented,
00:51:17.250 --> 00:51:18.666
that is you\'re illegal.
00:51:18.750 --> 00:51:22.416
We have 10 women,
all were married,
00:51:22.500 --> 00:51:25.291
none were on public assistance.
00:51:25.375 --> 00:51:28.083
CLAUDIA: What you\'ve got is,
indigent patients coming into
00:51:28.166 --> 00:51:30.416
teaching hospitals,
young doctors needing to do
00:51:30.500 --> 00:51:33.333
all kinds of pelvic operations.
00:51:33.416 --> 00:51:36.750
You have the problem that
other doctors have very strong
00:51:36.833 --> 00:51:39.708
attitudes on population
and they have the power to
00:51:39.791 --> 00:51:41.833
work it out, on people.
00:51:42.458 --> 00:51:45.041
I did go and
interview Dr. Quilligan.
00:51:45.125 --> 00:51:49.583
He really didn\'t understand
what had gone on there
00:51:49.666 --> 00:51:52.208
that was morally problematic.
00:51:53.833 --> 00:51:58.125
I don\'t feel he felt
that he had done harm or
00:51:58.208 --> 00:52:00.375
that people under
him had done harm.
00:52:00.833 --> 00:52:03.083
I think he was
genuinely puzzled.
00:52:04.375 --> 00:52:05.625
REPORTER: Could we just,
00:52:05.708 --> 00:52:07.666
in general terms ask you
what the hospital\'s position
00:52:07.750 --> 00:52:08.916
is on all of this?
00:52:09.000 --> 00:52:12.375
QUILLIGAN: We were practicing
good medicine that the,
00:52:12.458 --> 00:52:14.833
uh, the Physicians,
who I know personally,
00:52:14.916 --> 00:52:17.083
were all very fine physicians.
00:52:17.166 --> 00:52:20.541
Uh, I felt were giving
good care to the patients,
00:52:20.625 --> 00:52:23.958
they were giving the best
care that they knew how to give.
00:52:24.041 --> 00:52:27.291
These were women
undergoing a caesarean section.
00:52:27.375 --> 00:52:28.708
And they had to
be talked to about a
00:52:28.791 --> 00:52:30.625
major surgical procedure.
00:52:30.708 --> 00:52:34.000
So, they had to be aware
enough to be consent for a
00:52:34.083 --> 00:52:36.625
major surgical procedure.
00:52:38.166 --> 00:52:40.375
I, I have to presume they
were awake enough to know
00:52:40.458 --> 00:52:43.166
they were consenting to
also having their tubes tied.
00:52:52.916 --> 00:52:56.416
NEUMANN: It is horrible
to have your name splashed on
00:52:56.500 --> 00:52:59.291
the front page
of the \"LA Times\".
00:52:59.375 --> 00:53:03.666
To have headlines
questioning your motives,
00:53:05.541 --> 00:53:07.333
as to what you\'re doing.
00:53:07.416 --> 00:53:10.500
I knew personally I had not
done anything, I could not,
00:53:10.583 --> 00:53:13.750
for the life of me, think
of any of my colleagues who
00:53:13.833 --> 00:53:17.458
would have deliberately
done this, we busted our,
00:53:17.541 --> 00:53:24.625
mmmph, in order to provide
care for a lot of people,
00:53:25.875 --> 00:53:27.500
and got sued for it.
00:53:28.250 --> 00:53:30.125
KREITZER: To a sort
of claim that we, well,
00:53:30.208 --> 00:53:32.208
we\'re part of greater
goal of sterilizing the
00:53:32.291 --> 00:53:36.666
Mexican population, that
emigrates to Los Angeles,
00:53:36.750 --> 00:53:38.625
I mean, I am offended by that.
00:53:38.791 --> 00:53:40.750
That\'s not what we did.
00:53:40.833 --> 00:53:42.541
That\'s not what we discussed.
00:53:42.625 --> 00:53:45.166
That\'s not what
anybody even intimated,
00:53:46.750 --> 00:53:49.916
at least not while I
was at LA County hospital.
00:53:51.166 --> 00:53:53.750
CONSUELO: But why
were they doing it for?
00:53:53.833 --> 00:53:56.791
I feel that they were
doing it to Hispanics.
00:53:57.166 --> 00:54:01.708
But, I mean, were they doing
it for not supporting these kids
00:54:01.791 --> 00:54:03.833
at the eh, in the future?
00:54:04.541 --> 00:54:06.708
Or were they getting
money at the hospital for
00:54:06.791 --> 00:54:09.666
doing more sterilization?
00:54:09.833 --> 00:54:12.166
I always kept those
questions in me, I,
00:54:12.250 --> 00:54:14.458
I never get those answers.
00:54:16.458 --> 00:54:18.018
BLANCHETTE: You know,
I\'m not disputing,
00:54:18.083 --> 00:54:20.625
with regard to the
Latino population,
00:54:20.708 --> 00:54:25.083
that there was actual feelings
of prejudice um, you know,
00:54:25.166 --> 00:54:29.583
but I don\'t think that,
that, that, that, that feeling
00:54:29.666 --> 00:54:32.958
you know got translated into,
I need to sterilize her.
00:54:33.458 --> 00:54:35.125
MARIA: That\'s what
I really think that\'s what
00:54:35.208 --> 00:54:37.708
their agenda was too.
00:54:37.791 --> 00:54:41.125
I will say it, in me, and I
don\'t know but I\'ll say I think
00:54:41.208 --> 00:54:43.666
they thought little gods,
that they can do everything;
00:54:43.750 --> 00:54:47.833
and repair the world, something
but that\'s not a way to do it.
00:54:52.291 --> 00:54:54.541
FRANK: These are 3 of 10
of the women who sued federal
00:54:54.625 --> 00:54:58.375
and state officials and doctors
at county USC medical center
00:54:58.458 --> 00:54:59.250
for violating their
00:54:59.333 --> 00:55:02.041
constitutional
rights to have children.
00:55:02.708 --> 00:55:05.541
ANTONIA: They went into hospital
to give birth to a child,
00:55:05.625 --> 00:55:09.958
that while at the hospital
in labor having complications;
00:55:10.041 --> 00:55:12.083
We are saying that
it was not a free,
00:55:12.166 --> 00:55:16.291
informed or voluntary
consent and that thereby the
00:55:16.375 --> 00:55:19.833
civil rights of
these women were violated.
00:55:20.666 --> 00:55:22.066
FRANK: From the
federal court house,
00:55:22.125 --> 00:55:24.041
Frank Cruz, News Center 4.
00:55:25.666 --> 00:55:29.041
GERARDO: Antonia Hernandez
call La Opinion to inform the
00:55:29.125 --> 00:55:31.041
paper about
this particular case.
00:55:32.458 --> 00:55:36.083
I became very interested and
wrote a story and then from then
00:55:36.166 --> 00:55:40.250
on I was there in court
listening to all the testimony
00:55:40.333 --> 00:55:42.000
from both sides.
00:55:43.000 --> 00:55:46.541
NANCY: The reason why the
senior partner called me in for
00:55:46.625 --> 00:55:49.666
an interview was
actually because of this case,
00:55:49.750 --> 00:55:51.291
The Madrigal case.
00:55:51.375 --> 00:55:55.000
My maiden name is Menzies,
which is Scottish,
00:55:55.083 --> 00:55:59.125
but he remembered it as
\"Mendez\" and he also remembered,
00:55:59.208 --> 00:56:02.166
that obviously I was a female,
00:56:02.250 --> 00:56:05.958
so he had his
secretary go back and search
00:56:06.041 --> 00:56:09.125
through this \"Mendez lady\"
00:56:09.208 --> 00:56:11.458
and then once he got
me in there he realized
00:56:11.541 --> 00:56:13.541
that because I had
blonde hair and blue eyes
00:56:13.625 --> 00:56:15.791
that I probably wasn\'t Hispanic,
00:56:15.875 --> 00:56:18.083
but he figured two
out of three wasn\'t bad.
00:56:23.041 --> 00:56:27.250
ANTONIA: In the courts, um, you,
at random you are given a judge.
00:56:28.041 --> 00:56:32.625
So we tried the case before
the Federal Judge Jesse Curtis.
00:56:34.875 --> 00:56:37.875
CHARLES: We sought
to tie that in with,
00:56:37.958 --> 00:56:40.500
that pattern and practice
as being a violation of the
00:56:40.583 --> 00:56:44.666
civil rights as
recognized by Roe v. Wade
00:56:44.750 --> 00:56:49.208
that a woman had an
individual right to procreate.
00:56:52.875 --> 00:56:54.750
CARLOS: I just
found my testimony.
00:56:55.166 --> 00:56:58.708
We were trying to
compose a different narrative.
00:56:58.916 --> 00:57:00.375
This is not an
economic question.
00:57:00.458 --> 00:57:03.000
This is a moral question,
it\'s an ethical question.
00:57:03.875 --> 00:57:07.666
It\'s a question of
whether a woman has, um,
00:57:09.583 --> 00:57:15.250
the inalienable cultural
and biological right to choose.
00:57:24.125 --> 00:57:25.791
GERARDO: At the
beginning I says yes,
00:57:25.875 --> 00:57:28.666
this is an orderly
way of business, yes, is,
00:57:28.750 --> 00:57:30.333
justice is being carried out.
00:57:31.000 --> 00:57:35.791
The presentation given by, ehm,
the lawyers Antonia Hernandez
00:57:36.125 --> 00:57:39.208
and Nabarrette and they
were, they were methodical,
00:57:39.416 --> 00:57:41.083
they were consistent.
00:58:20.041 --> 00:58:21.791
ANTONIA: It was a
compelling case, but you know,
00:58:21.875 --> 00:58:25.041
having a sense that
right was on our side,
00:58:25.125 --> 00:58:28.083
the public was on our side.
00:58:30.041 --> 00:58:34.916
FRANK: The defendants,
the doctors made it very clear
00:58:35.666 --> 00:58:38.416
that it, it was almost like
a routine matter for them.
00:58:39.583 --> 00:58:43.708
ANTONIA: No local doctor wanted
to testify against the practice,
00:58:44.416 --> 00:58:46.750
it was the old boys network.
00:58:47.083 --> 00:58:49.708
Nobody wanted to testify
against these doctors,
00:58:50.250 --> 00:58:52.958
these were the pillars
of the medical community.
00:58:54.791 --> 00:58:56.583
KREITZER: The premise of
the trial and the premise
00:58:56.666 --> 00:59:02.250
of the publicity aspect was
that there was a conspiracy at
00:59:02.333 --> 00:59:06.208
LA County hospital and
that this is social engineering
00:59:06.291 --> 00:59:09.833
and that it was organized,
and it came from the top.
00:59:10.666 --> 00:59:12.333
Quilligan.
00:59:12.500 --> 00:59:15.083
Nothing could be
further from the truth.
00:59:18.291 --> 00:59:21.333
GERARDO: Then it got to
this point when the judge
00:59:21.416 --> 00:59:26.083
first approves the motion to to
disqualify the charges against,
00:59:26.166 --> 00:59:31.291
uh, Quilligan, that whatever
happened it was something
00:59:31.375 --> 00:59:34.583
between the
doctor and the patient.
00:59:36.583 --> 00:59:39.666
QUILLIGAN: Well, the ultimate
responsibility is with me,
00:59:39.750 --> 00:59:42.416
because I\'m running it.
00:59:42.833 --> 00:59:45.250
But it comes up through a
chain of command and comes down
00:59:45.333 --> 00:59:49.083
through a chain of
command, I, obviously, I,
00:59:49.166 --> 00:59:51.250
as an individual
can\'t be present at
00:59:51.333 --> 00:59:54.375
every counseling session.
00:59:54.625 --> 00:59:57.708
NANCY: I got to argue the
motion that I had filed that
00:59:57.791 --> 01:00:01.666
was successful in getting
doctors Quilligan and Freeman
01:00:01.750 --> 01:00:04.250
dismissed from the case.
01:00:04.333 --> 01:00:08.583
Because of their position
as basically supervisors and
01:00:08.666 --> 01:00:11.833
not being individually
involved w the plaintiffs.
01:00:13.083 --> 01:00:17.916
There was legal basis to
argue for them to be eliminated
01:00:18.000 --> 01:00:19.416
from the lawsuit.
01:00:27.375 --> 01:00:28.666
ROGER: It was a
civil rights case, and
01:00:28.750 --> 01:00:31.333
they found, uh, that
we were not guilty
01:00:31.416 --> 01:00:33.458
of depriving people
of their civil rights.
01:00:35.833 --> 01:00:40.291
NANCY: When Dr. Quilligan and
Dr. Freeman are not parties to
01:00:40.375 --> 01:00:44.625
the lawsuit, we can only
look at the individual doctors
01:00:44.708 --> 01:00:47.833
who were named as defendants and
01:00:47.916 --> 01:00:51.541
who were actually
served and were there,
01:00:51.625 --> 01:00:57.458
this was specifically, 10
plaintiffs suing 10 defendants.
01:01:01.916 --> 01:01:04.708
GERARDO: And from that point on,
I saw that the presentations of
01:01:04.791 --> 01:01:08.166
the doctors, and, and,
and, and it went really fast,
01:01:08.458 --> 01:01:10.583
the trial started
moving very, very,
01:01:10.666 --> 01:01:13.166
very fast at that
particular point.
01:01:15.250 --> 01:01:17.375
CONSUELO: When I was
going to court I was mad.
01:01:17.458 --> 01:01:19.708
I was mad.
01:01:19.791 --> 01:01:23.500
I wasn\'t getting welfare,
my husband had a job.
01:01:24.000 --> 01:01:28.250
I was here since 1953, I came
in legal, and I speak English.
01:01:28.625 --> 01:01:30.625
That\'s, they don\'t
have no rights.
01:01:30.708 --> 01:01:33.000
That\'s not, that\'s
not their decision, it\'s,
01:01:33.083 --> 01:01:35.875
it\'s our decision.
01:01:35.958 --> 01:01:39.000
NEUMANN: This is a
lot of he said she said;
01:01:39.083 --> 01:01:42.291
and no one knows
exactly what was said.
01:01:43.166 --> 01:01:47.708
Eh, what, my legal friends
have taught me is if it\'s
01:01:47.791 --> 01:01:49.916
not written down,
it didn\'t happen.
01:01:52.333 --> 01:01:55.041
CHARLES: She was at the
tail end of labor where she
01:01:55.125 --> 01:01:59.958
was really experiencing a lot
of pain and discomfort and just
01:02:00.041 --> 01:02:02.500
wanted to give birth
to her child and
01:02:02.583 --> 01:02:05.000
they had her sign
the, the form while
01:02:05.083 --> 01:02:09.875
she was in the gurney and
wrote \"no mas hijos por vida,\"
01:02:11.333 --> 01:02:13.541
It means \"no more
babies for life.\"
01:02:15.500 --> 01:02:18.791
NANCY: There\'s a lot of emotion
that goes on in those cases.
01:02:19.208 --> 01:02:24.666
But particularly when you\'re
on the defense side you have to
01:02:24.750 --> 01:02:27.250
look at what the facts are.
01:02:27.916 --> 01:02:33.000
And how it can be explained
and that\'s why I said the
01:02:33.083 --> 01:02:35.875
documentation is so important.
01:02:35.958 --> 01:02:39.166
JOE: The doctors, uh, if all
they\'re going to do is look at
01:02:39.250 --> 01:02:42.833
a piece of paper and not
think about who the patient is,
01:02:42.916 --> 01:02:45.708
or what language the patient
speaks or where the patient came
01:02:45.791 --> 01:02:51.083
from then yeah, they can
quite honestly, to themselves,
01:02:51.166 --> 01:02:54.000
rationalize by saying \"Well,
I had a piece of paper.\"
01:02:54.916 --> 01:02:57.875
NANCY: When you have
excellent documentation,
01:02:57.958 --> 01:03:00.833
you use that documentation.
01:03:01.750 --> 01:03:06.500
JOE: No, informed consent is,
it requires that people actually
01:03:06.583 --> 01:03:10.125
understand, what they\'re doing.
01:03:10.208 --> 01:03:12.208
They have an opportunity
to think about it,
01:03:12.291 --> 01:03:14.833
talk to other people about
it if they want to and then
01:03:14.916 --> 01:03:20.000
make a decision and
that nothing like that was
01:03:20.083 --> 01:03:22.416
happening in these clinics.
01:03:26.291 --> 01:03:29.000
ROSENFELD: Now, I was driving
home from one of my emergency
01:03:29.083 --> 01:03:33.166
room shifts and it seemed
like it was 7 or 8 at night
01:03:33.416 --> 01:03:37.916
and I parked, and then I
realized this other car parked
01:03:38.000 --> 01:03:42.666
about four parking spots
away from me and I got out,
01:03:42.750 --> 01:03:49.333
all of a sudden this
guy is following me into our
01:03:49.416 --> 01:03:54.333
apartment which was real small
and I asked him, so I just,
01:03:54.416 --> 01:03:56.708
you know I wasn\'t afraid
that he was going to mug me,
01:03:56.791 --> 01:03:58.541
I said, you know
\"What are you doing?\"
01:03:58.625 --> 01:03:59.875
and he said he was with the
01:03:59.958 --> 01:04:02.166
California Board
of Medical Examiners.
01:04:02.833 --> 01:04:06.583
I mean, they thought, really,
that I was getting money from
01:04:06.666 --> 01:04:09.708
the lawyers and that, they,
they couldn\'t believe that
01:04:09.791 --> 01:04:12.458
I just did this because
I thought it was wrong.
01:04:18.833 --> 01:04:20.916
REPORTER: This surgeon,
who asked to remain anonymous
01:04:21.000 --> 01:04:23.875
because he feared reprisals
from other doctors, says that...
01:04:23.958 --> 01:04:27.000
ROSENFELD: They did file a
complaint to take away my
01:04:27.083 --> 01:04:32.250
license, saying that I
gave hospital information out
01:04:32.333 --> 01:04:36.791
to 3rd parties, and that
essentially letting these women
01:04:36.875 --> 01:04:38.708
who were sterilized,
01:04:38.791 --> 01:04:41.166
letting them know
that they were sterilized.
01:04:49.083 --> 01:04:52.666
JOE: He was questioning the
ethics of, of his colleagues.
01:04:52.750 --> 01:04:57.125
And he was persistent
about it and unrelenting and
01:04:57.208 --> 01:04:59.416
they did not like that.
01:05:01.833 --> 01:05:06.291
CAROL: One day she said
that she had to go to the court.
01:05:07.375 --> 01:05:09.125
And she come inside
and you stay inside you
01:05:09.208 --> 01:05:11.208
don\'t go back outside, you eat.
01:05:11.291 --> 01:05:13.375
Because I don\'t know
how long it\'s gonna be.
01:05:14.250 --> 01:05:17.708
It had to be something serious
because she just would leave.
01:05:18.291 --> 01:05:22.166
ANTONIA: Having to
testify on a very embarrassing
01:05:22.250 --> 01:05:26.583
private matter, and would
just put through the ringer.
01:05:27.250 --> 01:05:29.750
Their testimony was so
compelling that sometimes,
01:05:29.833 --> 01:05:31.250
when they were testifying,
01:05:31.333 --> 01:05:33.166
there were tears
in the courtroom.
01:05:34.916 --> 01:05:36.958
(speaking in Spanish)
01:05:37.041 --> 01:05:39.666
CARLOS: \"My song is finished.\"
01:05:39.750 --> 01:05:43.833
A phrase that one of the women
used when she said basically
01:05:43.916 --> 01:05:50.333
that the sterilization had,
uh, finished her song of life.
01:05:54.791 --> 01:05:58.250
They were disrupted
socially from their kin,
01:05:58.333 --> 01:06:00.000
they were distrupted
from each other,
01:06:00.083 --> 01:06:02.500
and many times husband and wife.
01:06:03.208 --> 01:06:05.833
A lot of these
women after a while removed
01:06:05.916 --> 01:06:08.750
themselves from those networks.
01:06:09.916 --> 01:06:11.666
CONSUELO: I used to cry.
01:06:11.750 --> 01:06:14.083
When I see I\'m at a
baby shower, sometimes I said
01:06:14.166 --> 01:06:16.833
\"I don\'t want to go
to the baby shower.\"
01:06:19.958 --> 01:06:21.250
When you walk in a party
01:06:21.333 --> 01:06:22.708
\"Oh, when are you
gonna get pregnant?\"
01:06:22.791 --> 01:06:25.166
I wasn\'t going to
hang a tag in my front and
01:06:25.250 --> 01:06:27.541
say I can\'t have kids anymore.
01:06:35.916 --> 01:06:39.000
CARLOS: It\'s trauma,
it\'s like combat.
01:06:40.291 --> 01:06:43.333
These women were suffering
from post traumatic stress.
01:07:01.958 --> 01:07:05.458
MARIA: My husband his reaction,
he had a lot of family here.
01:07:05.583 --> 01:07:07.791
He didn\'t want none
of his family to know.
01:07:08.291 --> 01:07:11.833
He told me very clearly
no interviews, no talking.
01:07:13.375 --> 01:07:16.791
I went to the hearing only
the hearing in the court and,
01:07:16.875 --> 01:07:19.958
and I never got a
chance to testify.
01:07:20.208 --> 01:07:24.416
I did not, was not allowed
through my husband to continue.
01:07:24.583 --> 01:07:27.375
He would say we\'re
moving and I don\'t want to
01:07:27.458 --> 01:07:29.541
hear anything more about it.
01:07:30.583 --> 01:07:33.500
I stay in the marriage
because of my children.
01:07:34.500 --> 01:07:36.541
The kids suffer, I suffer.
01:08:19.125 --> 01:08:20.250
He was talking to me
01:08:20.333 --> 01:08:22.333
positive things,
that \"are you married?\"
01:08:22.791 --> 01:08:24.333
and \"Do you have kids?\"
01:08:24.666 --> 01:08:26.291
\"Yes, I have three kids.\"
01:08:26.666 --> 01:08:29.541
And he told me \"Do you think
they are gonna be happy when.\"
01:08:34.166 --> 01:08:35.833
\"When you die?\"
01:08:44.375 --> 01:08:48.666
♪ ♪
01:08:50.333 --> 01:08:51.916
QUILLIGAN: It wasn\'t ideal.
01:08:52.000 --> 01:08:54.541
I think the ideal
time to discuss it is
01:08:54.625 --> 01:08:56.125
before they go into labor.
01:08:56.208 --> 01:08:59.625
But, if you see a patient, for
the first time, who\'s in labor,
01:09:00.666 --> 01:09:05.708
uh, who has a large number of
children and one of the things
01:09:05.791 --> 01:09:09.416
you discuss with her is the
possibility of tubal ligation,
01:09:09.500 --> 01:09:12.166
I think it\'s
perfectly appropriate.
01:09:12.583 --> 01:09:14.958
ROSENFELD: No
private doctor, ever,
01:09:15.041 --> 01:09:21.000
would go up to a woman in a
private hospital while she was
01:09:21.083 --> 01:09:24.041
in labor and ask if she
wanted to get her tubes tied.
01:09:25.541 --> 01:09:29.541
He, heh, you know, probably
would have gotten thrown out of
01:09:29.625 --> 01:09:32.500
the hospital and got
sued by the patient.
01:09:42.875 --> 01:09:46.833
JOE: It was so offensive,
it was so un-American, uh,
01:09:47.500 --> 01:09:51.458
it was so violative
of due process.
01:09:52.791 --> 01:09:56.791
NANCY: I really firmly
believed that the doctors,
01:09:56.875 --> 01:10:01.458
the individual doctors in these
cases did what said they did.
01:10:02.083 --> 01:10:03.791
FRANK: Attorneys for
the women say they expect the
01:10:03.875 --> 01:10:05.708
case to be completed, next week.
01:10:05.791 --> 01:10:07.916
Then it will be up to
the judge to determine if
01:10:08.000 --> 01:10:09.750
the doctors were guilty.
01:10:17.875 --> 01:10:20.625
I got word at least, being
the only television reporter
01:10:20.708 --> 01:10:25.250
that covered the story that,
uh, Judge Curtis was going to
01:10:25.333 --> 01:10:27.875
come down with a
decision that afternoon.
01:10:32.250 --> 01:10:35.125
ANTONIA: When we got called
that the decision was in and
01:10:35.208 --> 01:10:38.541
the press was there because
they were very interested.
01:10:39.750 --> 01:10:42.625
I remember him ruling
from the bench and the reason
01:10:42.708 --> 01:10:47.708
I remember the clerk is cause,
you know, where attorneys sit,
01:10:47.791 --> 01:10:50.416
I was, he was right
in front of my face.
01:10:50.583 --> 01:10:52.625
And so, I remember
the two things,
01:10:52.708 --> 01:10:55.583
the judge\'s face
and the clerk\'s face.
01:10:56.208 --> 01:11:01.958
Even his clerk was shocked
that we had lost the case.
01:11:32.750 --> 01:11:36.125
ANTONIA: I remember rushing
out of the courtroom and
01:11:36.375 --> 01:11:39.500
in fact Frank followed me.
01:11:41.958 --> 01:11:48.625
And I remember wanting to cry,
and I remember Frank saying
01:11:49.041 --> 01:11:53.541
\"Do not cry, you be strong,
you\'re going to be on camera,
01:11:54.041 --> 01:11:57.666
we\'re going to interview you,
you got to project strength.\"
01:11:58.916 --> 01:12:01.500
CARLOS: You know what, I
have to be very frank with you,
01:12:01.583 --> 01:12:03.875
I\'ve repressed this.
01:12:14.333 --> 01:12:16.208
This has been so painful.
01:12:25.041 --> 01:12:29.541
What the judge did, the reason
he allowed me to testify
01:12:29.625 --> 01:12:33.333
was that he could use the
rationalization of a subculture
01:12:34.166 --> 01:12:37.083
in a way to blame the
women for their feelings
01:12:37.166 --> 01:12:39.958
of being sterilized.
01:12:41.041 --> 01:12:44.416
He had already set
me up in his questioning,
01:12:46.208 --> 01:12:49.375
so therefore, his decision
was that the doctors could not
01:12:49.458 --> 01:12:54.083
have known that they would
be damaged by the sterilization
01:12:56.083 --> 01:12:59.375
because they belonged to
a subculture that had taken
01:12:59.458 --> 01:13:02.666
the anthropologist six
months to figure out.
01:13:19.875 --> 01:13:21.791
FRANK: Justice grinds
exceedingly slow and fine,
01:13:21.875 --> 01:13:23.416
sometimes.
01:13:23.500 --> 01:13:27.166
You know, it played a role
changing society\'s thinking
01:13:27.500 --> 01:13:30.833
about that issue, and the
medical profession changing
01:13:30.916 --> 01:13:33.083
its ways, and
the county hospital
01:13:33.166 --> 01:13:35.166
having to change its ways.
01:13:35.833 --> 01:13:37.875
The federal
government has agreed to
01:13:37.958 --> 01:13:39.916
provide consent forms
in English and Spanish,
01:13:40.000 --> 01:13:41.833
and the state has agreed
to provide bilingual
01:13:41.916 --> 01:13:44.208
counselors at county hospitals.
01:13:44.666 --> 01:13:46.708
BLANCHETTE: In retrospect
it was good that they,
01:13:46.791 --> 01:13:49.625
they enacted
the class action suit.
01:13:49.708 --> 01:13:53.666
Because what it did, it
then it challenged this nation
01:13:53.750 --> 01:13:56.291
to look and say you know what?
01:13:56.375 --> 01:13:57.791
We were wrong.
01:13:57.958 --> 01:14:00.083
ANTONIA: Informed
or voluntary consent...
01:14:00.833 --> 01:14:02.291
We didn\'t win it
through the court case,
01:14:02.375 --> 01:14:05.000
but we won it
through regulatory changes.
01:14:05.375 --> 01:14:07.791
But as to the
specific women of the,
01:14:07.875 --> 01:14:12.000
the women involved in this
case, they received no remedy.
01:14:14.583 --> 01:14:16.041
CARLOS: This is an
interview that I did
01:14:16.125 --> 01:14:20.916
on May the 22, of 1978
of Mrs. Hermosillo.
01:15:29.500 --> 01:15:32.375
The way I felt when I was young,
01:15:32.458 --> 01:15:34.583
it doesn\'t change really it,
01:15:34.666 --> 01:15:38.166
the way I feel in my
heart now that I\'m older.
01:15:38.916 --> 01:15:40.416
But it\'s there all the time,
01:15:40.500 --> 01:15:42.958
it\'s like when you
bury somebody you\'re always
01:15:43.041 --> 01:15:45.375
going to carry it on your head.
01:16:05.833 --> 01:16:10.458
(singing in Spanish)
01:16:17.000 --> 01:16:20.000
CONSUELO: I want her to have
liberty on doing what she wants,
01:16:20.333 --> 01:16:22.083
going to school
wherever she wants,
01:16:22.166 --> 01:16:24.125
decides how many kids she wants.
01:17:02.833 --> 01:17:07.166
♪ ♪
01:17:46.291 --> 01:17:50.000
(music playing through credits)
