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(clock ticking)

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- [Operator] Man assaulting a woman.

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Possible domestic violence.

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- [Operator] Okay, don\'t cry, we\'re gonna send the police.

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- [Child] Okay.

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Okay.

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- [Operator] They\'re on the way

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but I\'m gonna keep you on the line \'til they get there.

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- [Woman] The police are coming.

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(siren blaring)

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(clock ticking)

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(brooding pulsating music)

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- I took my husband\'s life in a public parking lot.

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The more I tried to figure out how to remove myself

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from the situation, it just got worse and worse.

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In the end he strode back to his car and raised his trunk.

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I feel and I know that he was going for a tire iron

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that he had threatened me with the week before,

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so I ran my car into the back of his car.

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(woman speaking over intercom)

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It\'s a hard thing, even today.

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And why did I do it, why?

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I was pregnant with our second daughter,

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eight months pregnant, was the first time

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he truly got physical by shoving me into a wall.

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As the violence and anger escalated,

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I never doubted for a minute his threats.

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He told me from the earliest days,

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the only solution is for both of us to die.

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I never doubted it.

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Over time, it wears you down.

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It wears you down, \'till you don\'t know what you believe in.

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(talking over radio)

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I came to prison at 44 but I still

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feel like I grew up in prison,

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cause I lost who I was.

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What I felt about things, but I grew up.

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- [Woman] Ladies, could all of you ladies

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sign in on the white sign up sheet?

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- Welcome ladies, everyone.

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Any new members that we have to

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Convicted Women Against Abuse tonight.

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I think what I was reaching out for and what I found was,

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it didn\'t just happen to me, that it happened to many women.

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In different ways and different aspects.

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But to know that we weren\'t alone,

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I think that was a very important factor.

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- I was sitting in this group one night

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and Glenda was telling her story and it was so similar.

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Everything about it and she was the wife

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and the three kids and the dog, you know.

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But her story was just like mine.

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And it made me know that we were all

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in partnership, we were sisters.

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And I\'m so glad for this group that

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I found out that it wasn\'t just me.

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- Convicted Women Against Abuse has done so much.

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Not only for the prison and for the women,

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but it has also done so much for the communities

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out there because so many laws have been passed

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cause it has gotten so much recognition.

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- [News Anchor] Locked behind bars,

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these women are making history.

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Not for killing the men they once loved,

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but for forming a support group to fight for change.

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- You know something?

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From inside this prison, we\'re doing something.

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We\'ve all been treated as though

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we were cold blooded killers.

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- [News Anchor] This group, the first of its kind

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in the US prison system, was created

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by inmate Brenda Clubine, a woman who discovered

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a sisterhood of prisoners with the same dark past

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of domestic violence, seeking a source of hope.

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- I see today how many new faces are there

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and the sadness is that I see many of the same faces.

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They were all part of that, they\'re all part of

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making a difference and educating people.

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Making a difference in the lives of

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the people that are there, even more importantly.

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And it\'s a place where women can heal.

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You learn from your past, you take those things

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and you build on those things and you say,

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\"Yeah, I did this but this is what I\'m gonna do now.\"

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You know, \"I did that wrong but

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\"this is how I\'m gonna change that.\"

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If you do those things, then you

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continue to move forward, you know?

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And you feel better with each step

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of accomplishment that you make.

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And you feel like, \"Wow, I did accomplish something,

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\"oh wow I did that, I did that.\"

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- I can\'t do this.

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- [Woman] Rosemary, keep going.

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You\'ve gotta share your story, don\'t be afraid.

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- [Woman] Just remember it gets easier.

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- (laughs) Right.

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Silence, you learn it at a young age.

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When I was being beaten, at home, with my father.

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When I was being molested, everything is silence.

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You don\'t tell, you don\'t talk.

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- I said if a man ever hit me

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I would walk out the door immediately.

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That isn\'t exactly what happened.

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It didn\'t start out as abuse.

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He was my knight in shining armor,

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he was the most excitement that I\'d ever had in my life.

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It was different and new and exciting

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and all of the things that you dream about, you know?

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When someone sweeps you off of your feet,

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that\'s a big warning sign.

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Girls, do not.

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If you\'re being swept off your feet,

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it\'s probably a little dangerous sign.

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- I met my husband, he ended up being worse than my father.

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I was tied up, I was beaten, he used instruments on me.

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He used guns to sexually molest me with,

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he used knives, he used anything he thought he could.

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Then there was the silence.

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You don\'t talk, I had no friends,

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I wasn\'t allowed to associate with anyone, who would I tell?

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Who would I be not silent with?

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- If I\'d a shut up, I\'d a got hit a lot less.

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If I\'d a just backed down, it wouldn\'t of been so bad.

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Took about seven years, and seven into this group,

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somebody said, if he didn\'t hit his friends,

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and he didn\'t hit his boss who made him angry,

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he made conscious decisions while he was angry.

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That means he made a conscious decision

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that you weren\'t worth holding back from.

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- My whole marriage I tried to protect my husband.

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I didn\'t want people to feel, to look at him badly.

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It was stupid.

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I didn\'t want them looking at him badly in his grave.

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Or maybe somewhere I didn\'t want them looking at me,

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since I was the one left behind.

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Silence is a killer.

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My name is Rosemary and I\'m a survivor.

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(clapping)

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- [Woman] Okay everybody, if you can,

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take one step in closer.

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I think we can do it again.

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(laughing)

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- We had to learn and understand that,

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the house ain\'t worth it, he ain\'t worth it,

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those fake tears ain\'t worth it,

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it ain\'t gonna work and no I\'m not coming back.

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If I paid attention to those clues years ago,

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I never would have married him.

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When he started telling me what to do and what not to do.

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What makeup I could wear and what makeup I couldn\'t.

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What friend I could have and what friend I couldn\'t

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and how they were no good in my life,

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they really don\'t care about me.

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God, I thought he loved me and

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what he was doing was isolating me.

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Okay, if I knew that then, jeez,

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if I only knew then what I know now.

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Because it went from one incident to the next.

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I felt like I couldn\'t breathe.

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I was beaten around every single wall.

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I had three broken ribs, I had a broken collar bone.

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And all I could think about was I failed my son.

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I failed, because I couldn\'t make it work.

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I tried and I tried and I tried

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and I couldn\'t make it work, I just couldn\'t.

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- Today I know that there were

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many reasons why I didn\'t leave.

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There\'s no one set answer to that question.

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After awhile you don\'t feel capable of

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raising children on your own, financially, psychologically.

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You\'re somewhat, in a sick way,

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you\'re dependent on the man that\'s making your life hell.

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- In my study of women who are convicted

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for the death of their abusers,

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they wanted to find out what brought them to that point.

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We like to think that it\'s always someone else

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who falls prey to victimization,

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it makes us feel safer to believe that.

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We always think, I used to think,

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well if that ever happened to me I\'d leave.

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But first of all, I\'d never get into

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that relationship to begin with.

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I assumed that, that was out of my own ignorance.

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Once I started investigating the lives and

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experiences of battered women and convicted battered women,

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I realized how easily it could be me.

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One reason I\'m so committed to articulating my research,

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is because their experience, the experience

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that these women have gone through,

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the highest end of abuse echoes the experience

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of those women who don\'t walk away that night.

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We have to learn from their experiences and

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learn from them so that we can help those on the outside.

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- He was very loving and caring and

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when I met him, I met him at a revival

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at my church, so he was in church.

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We dated from approximately two years

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before we married, I never detected any abuse.

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I can remember being bit, just fought like

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I was a man, hit like I was a man.

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And people say, \"Well, why didn\'t you just leave?\"

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It\'s not that simple all the time.

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And with me, knowing that okay,

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there was this side of him but then

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there was another side of him where

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he\'s a sweet, kind, loving, caring person.

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And that\'s what I focused on and praying

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that he would come out of this stupor that he was in

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because, like I said, he was a minister.

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- Why doesn\'t she just leave?

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That\'s the question we always ask.

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Let\'s think about the question some more.

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It assumes that leaving stops his violence.

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When actually, leaving escalates the violence.

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We have a term for it, it\'s called seperation assault.

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It happens so often that when she

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tries to leave, he intensifies his violence.

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In fact, she is at 75% increased risk

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for being killed after she leaves.

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And she stays at an increased risk for two years.

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Leaving does not stop the violence.

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- But if you\'re in the church, you\'re taught that okay,

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you hold on in there, God\'s gonna work it out,

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just have faith, just hold on, hold on.

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But it\'s not always that easy.

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- There\'s verbal abuse, emotional abuse,

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psychological abuse, mind games.

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There\'s a term, gas lighting, from the old

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Charles Boyer, Ingrid Bergman film.

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Back in the 40\'s I think it was,

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when he tries to make her go crazy

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in the film called, Gaslight.

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So, we use that term today to describe

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when an abuser systematically,

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sort of, makes her feel crazy.

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For example, he will say something

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and then she\'ll repeat it to him

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and he\'ll say, \"I never said that, that didn\'t happen.

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\"You fell, I didn\'t push you.\"

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And so on and so forth and unless there\'s someone else

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helping to define the situation,

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it\'s very difficult for her to start sorting out

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what is his creation versus what are her own thoughts.

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- Sometimes you wonder if, is this really

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happening or am I imagining it?

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We have a tendency to shrug off,

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because of love, what\'s really going on.

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And because of that,

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I denied myself of a lot and I endured a lot.

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- The physical violence is very terrifying.

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But at least it leaves a mark and it shows up in an x-ray.

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So in a way, it\'s easier for a victim

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to define that as abuse.

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It\'s much more difficult to define psychological,

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emotional, or verbal abuse as abusive.

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Actually, once women are away, escape an abuser,

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they say that the emotional and

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the psychological abuse is really the worst.

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Because they keep replaying those words and

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those incidents, long after the bruises have faded

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or the injuries have healed.

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(man talking over radio)

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- We don\'t even know the difference between

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unhealthy and unhealthy when you see a man who,

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you know, calls you a bitch, you think

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he\'s just having a bad day.

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You know, when you get into CWAA,

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you start recognizing that these are the subtle signs

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that things are going to escalate and

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get worse and they\'re never gonna get better.

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But when you come from an abusive past and

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you\'ve had an abusive relationship and

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you don\'t see any options, I didn\'t see any options,

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I saw no way out, I sought the only ways that I could find.

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One was police and the other one was my mother.

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Both of those options were not options, where was I to go?

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- Early stages of how you would deal with it and

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policing in the 70\'s and then the 80\'s

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and up until maybe the late 80\'s early 90\'s,

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was you would go in to someones home,

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when there was a domestic violence call,

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and you would separate the parties,

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you\'d interview them, you would warn them

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that if we have to come back to

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this house again, we\'re gonna make an arrest.

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And we weren\'t trained in how to identify

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the primary aggressor, we just kind of said,

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\"Hey, keep it down, resolve your problem,

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\"if we come back someone\'s going to jail.\"

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And that was the way we dealt with it.

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- I called the police at one point and

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and they told me that it was a domestic dispute and

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I didn\'t have any marks on my body and

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therefore, there was nothing they could do.

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I believe, if I\'m not mistaken,

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there wasn\'t shelters, it was in \'88, 1988.

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They had hotlines, I didn\'t find that out till later,

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but I found out later they did have hotlines.

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I don\'t know what they did but I don\'t think

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they ever had shelters at that point.

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But the police told me that there was

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nothing they could do, that he didn\'t

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leave any marks on me, so.

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- I think the law has been pretty good

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at adjusting itself and giving these options

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of restraining orders, keep away orders,

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and the like, to let anyone who\'s

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tempted to kill another person know that,

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you don\'t have to use that option.

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There\'s other things there for you.

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At the same time, you know, there are those who,

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when they beat a woman, will threaten

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if you tell the police, I\'ll kill you.

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So there\'s this imminent fear of being killed, also.

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But even if that\'s the case, there\'s always

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the escape route that\'s the best route.

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You just, instead of killing your husband

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in bed while he\'s asleep, what you do is,

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pack your belongings and get out of there

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and then go on to a safe haven and then

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reconstitute your life without putting

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yourself in jail for killing another person.

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- When I went to the police, I

19:50.517 --> 19:52.833
had slept in my car with my kids.

19:55.950 --> 19:57.630
In front of a friends house, I couldn\'t even

19:57.630 --> 20:01.640
sleep inside the house and it was pouring down rain.

20:01.640 --> 20:03.623
And my little son was still in diapers.

20:07.057 --> 20:10.233
He was just shivering and shaking, I couldn\'t do it anymore.

20:11.450 --> 20:13.440
So I went back and I kept going back and

20:13.440 --> 20:16.990
little incidents like that I just kept going back.

20:16.990 --> 20:18.940
Cause I had nowhere else to go.

20:18.940 --> 20:21.650
- It\'s not only a big problem for the victims,

20:21.650 --> 20:24.950
it\'s a bigger problem for the family that\'s

20:24.950 --> 20:27.945
being raised in that kind of environment.

20:27.945 --> 20:31.520
If we could eliminate violence in the home,

20:31.520 --> 20:33.440
we could probably eliminate 50%

20:33.440 --> 20:35.250
of our violence on the streets.

20:35.250 --> 20:37.340
We believe that many of these young people

20:37.340 --> 20:39.690
who are raised in a violent atmosphere,

20:39.690 --> 20:43.710
go on to become abusers, drug users,

20:43.710 --> 20:46.720
gang members, other violent felons.

20:46.720 --> 20:49.390
This is their role model, this is how they see

20:49.390 --> 20:53.883
their parents or the adults in their home interact.

20:55.260 --> 20:58.730
- I had to always be cautious that

20:58.730 --> 21:00.193
they weren\'t doing something wrong or that

21:00.193 --> 21:02.463
they were asleep when he came home or.

21:07.760 --> 21:09.580
He was so crazy, he would make them do

21:09.580 --> 21:11.840
jumping jacks over and over and over,

21:11.840 --> 21:15.190
just yell at them, throw things at them.

21:31.327 --> 21:32.460
My poor kids.

21:36.350 --> 21:38.070
- Domestic violence calls are some of the

21:38.070 --> 21:40.800
most dangerous calls we deal with.

21:40.800 --> 21:43.639
And they\'re very time consuming.

21:43.639 --> 21:46.260
But I think most importantly they\'re also

21:46.260 --> 21:51.260
very damaging to, not just the victim but the entire family.

21:52.030 --> 21:54.654
And so it\'s important that they\'re handled appropriately.

21:54.654 --> 21:56.614
- [Operator] San Diego emergency.

21:56.614 --> 22:01.614
- [Child] My mommy and daddy are having a fight.

22:01.710 --> 22:03.290
- [Operator] Is she getting hurt?

22:04.174 --> 22:05.230
- [Child] He\'s hurting mommy.

22:05.230 --> 22:06.250
- [Operator] How is he hurting her?

22:06.250 --> 22:07.847
- [Child] He might hit mommy.

22:10.870 --> 22:12.850
- [Operator] Okay, don\'t cry, we\'re gonna send the police.

22:12.850 --> 22:13.730
- [Child] Okay.

22:13.730 --> 22:14.563
- [Operator] They\'re on the way but

22:14.563 --> 22:15.396
I\'m gonna keep you on the line.

22:15.396 --> 22:17.810
- [Child] He just knocked my sister out.

22:19.760 --> 22:22.490
He pushed her down on the floor.

22:22.490 --> 22:25.157
I wish he would stop doing this.

22:26.170 --> 22:28.500
He just slapped mommy.

22:28.500 --> 22:29.333
- [Operator] Okay.

22:29.333 --> 22:33.938
- [Child] And he made them, ran behind, my momma\'s neck.

22:33.938 --> 22:34.771
Oh my god!

22:35.910 --> 22:37.395
- [Operator] What\'s the matter?

22:37.395 --> 22:40.636
- [Child] Something happened!

22:40.636 --> 22:43.636
Just please don\'t hurt mommy, mommy!

22:44.644 --> 22:46.352
- [Operator] Hello?

22:46.352 --> 22:48.685
(dial tone)

22:56.540 --> 23:00.100
- We hear from almost every battered woman or

23:00.100 --> 23:04.393
abused child, I\'m walking on egg shells.

23:05.830 --> 23:10.830
Because they know to watch the abusers every move.

23:12.520 --> 23:16.220
They have been taught and trained to watch for

23:16.220 --> 23:20.370
any cue that what they\'re doing is displeasing.

23:20.370 --> 23:23.513
Because if they\'re doing what\'s displeasing, they get hurt.

23:26.910 --> 23:29.420
- I, like everybody else, wondered well,

23:29.420 --> 23:32.730
if he doesn\'t like this maybe I should just stop it.

23:32.730 --> 23:36.223
But it was often little things.

23:37.800 --> 23:40.370
A dirty fork in the silverware drawer

23:41.450 --> 23:44.730
could set him off to rant and rave and

23:44.730 --> 23:48.313
terrorize the children and myself for an entire day.

23:49.930 --> 23:53.283
At the time, I just didn\'t know what to do.

23:55.070 --> 23:58.950
I stayed within that marriage for 24 years.

23:58.950 --> 24:02.940
And I often wonder, what was I thinking?

24:02.940 --> 24:07.940
I didn\'t have the skills, I didn\'t have the knowledge.

24:08.180 --> 24:12.800
I didn\'t know that any form of abuse was wrong

24:12.800 --> 24:14.873
and that I didn\'t have to take it.

24:16.229 --> 24:19.572
♪ I didn\'t even have time ♪

24:19.572 --> 24:23.320
♪ To get it straight in my mind ♪

24:23.320 --> 24:27.325
♪ To catch up from behind ♪

24:27.325 --> 24:30.720
♪ To see that I was blind ♪

24:30.720 --> 24:31.660
♪ And I wish I was wrong ♪

24:31.660 --> 24:34.170
- In Glenda\'s case, she was a woman with

24:34.170 --> 24:38.310
no history of violence, she was a middle aged mother,

24:38.310 --> 24:40.620
she had not ever been arrested before

24:40.620 --> 24:43.853
and she was, as I recall, about 40 years old.

24:44.870 --> 24:48.650
And so her lawyer would have said well, what caused this?

24:48.650 --> 24:52.110
And I think I should have someone talk to her

24:52.110 --> 24:56.000
to understand her mental state at the time.

24:56.000 --> 24:58.870
- There were times when I begged him, just stop,

25:01.019 --> 25:02.519
just stop, why can\'t you stop?

25:06.170 --> 25:09.610
There were times when he was suicidal

25:09.610 --> 25:14.080
and at his lowest that I cradled him in my arms

25:15.440 --> 25:18.523
and I told him he was a good man, we\'d get through it.

25:19.780 --> 25:22.763
One more time, we\'ll get through it, we\'d manage.

25:29.090 --> 25:31.303
And so we\'d get through one more hurdle.

25:33.750 --> 25:36.290
And then there would be another and another.

25:39.690 --> 25:43.503
- A number of killings where the woman killed her partner,

25:44.660 --> 25:47.110
involved the effects of battery,

25:47.110 --> 25:50.360
which at that time were called battered woman syndrome.

25:50.360 --> 25:53.900
And the effects of battering had to do with her perception.

25:53.900 --> 25:56.810
It\'s not our perception of whether she was in danger,

25:56.810 --> 25:59.040
it\'s what she feels based on

25:59.040 --> 26:01.073
what she knows about this person.

26:01.920 --> 26:05.520
When they see that danger, when they feel that

26:05.520 --> 26:08.020
man is angry at them, they flash on

26:08.020 --> 26:10.058
all the other times they\'ve been hurt.

26:10.058 --> 26:13.610
They often get so scared, they go into

26:13.610 --> 26:17.290
a dissociative state, where they\'re all about

26:17.290 --> 26:18.893
survival and protection.

26:19.900 --> 26:23.180
- General public in the 80\'s

26:23.180 --> 26:27.660
had no real idea of how many women were abused,

26:27.660 --> 26:29.720
the severity of the abuse they suffered,

26:29.720 --> 26:33.703
what was involved in their lives.

26:34.620 --> 26:38.810
And so they didn\'t appreciate those situations

26:38.810 --> 26:42.650
when they were presented with them as jurors.

26:42.650 --> 26:46.260
And so many jurors were not terribly sympathetic.

26:46.260 --> 26:48.840
- I\'m not a lawyer and I\'m not a judge

26:48.840 --> 26:51.820
but I just, I feel that she got,

26:51.820 --> 26:53.130
she had abuse throughout her life and

26:53.130 --> 26:56.080
now the system is abusing her because

26:57.890 --> 27:01.233
her story, what happened to her, didn\'t come out.

27:02.440 --> 27:05.730
He abused her for 20 years, she kills him in a

27:05.730 --> 27:07.830
three minute altercation in a parking lot.

27:09.300 --> 27:11.760
In any case, we are judging by

27:11.760 --> 27:14.840
what happened and the evidence given to us.

27:14.840 --> 27:15.903
She killed him.

27:17.610 --> 27:21.010
If they\'re gonna disregard in the way he abused her,

27:21.010 --> 27:23.513
then they\'re convicting her on half the information.

27:26.830 --> 27:30.100
♪ How it is right now ♪

27:30.100 --> 27:34.540
♪ Is how it\'s always gonna be ♪

27:34.540 --> 27:39.003
♪ It\'s here then it\'s gone ♪

27:39.003 --> 27:44.003
♪ Love doesn\'t last too long ♪

27:48.667 --> 27:53.372
♪ And I wish I was wrong ♪

27:53.372 --> 27:55.890
♪ Love doesn\'t last too long ♪

27:55.890 --> 27:58.220
- All jurors saw, because that was all that was

27:58.220 --> 28:01.464
presented to them, was a woman who had

28:01.464 --> 28:04.420
armed herself and killed an unarmed man.

28:04.420 --> 28:07.960
So those facts, if that\'s all you see,

28:07.960 --> 28:09.020
more often than not, you\'re gonna be

28:09.020 --> 28:11.283
convicted of first or second degree murder.

28:14.150 --> 28:18.280
- There were no laws at that time

28:19.880 --> 28:22.610
to make domestic violence,

28:22.610 --> 28:26.040
battered woman syndrome, admissible.

28:26.040 --> 28:29.113
A judge allowed it, but they made a sham of it.

28:30.450 --> 28:32.903
They told the jury, \"This is not a legal defense,

28:35.629 --> 28:38.793
\"we\'re only allowing her to tell what took place.\"

28:39.810 --> 28:42.980
- When a beating is a particular way,

28:42.980 --> 28:46.950
what he says is said in a particular tone of voice

28:46.950 --> 28:48.823
and over and over again we hear,

28:49.700 --> 28:53.453
the look in his eyes, I knew that this was it.

28:54.840 --> 28:56.680
I don\'t think those of us who haven\'t

28:56.680 --> 29:00.173
been there can say she was wrong.

29:01.300 --> 29:05.270
- These women, along with lots of other people

29:05.270 --> 29:07.670
who have been convicted of first and second degree murder,

29:07.670 --> 29:12.414
are in prison because of the process,

29:12.414 --> 29:14.170
not because of their cases,

29:14.170 --> 29:16.213
not because of the facts of their cases.

29:18.980 --> 29:20.420
- At 22, I don\'t know how well

29:20.420 --> 29:21.440
I could have made an argument,

29:21.440 --> 29:23.500
how bright I was enough to make the argument.

29:23.500 --> 29:25.790
But could there have been something

29:25.790 --> 29:27.610
I could have done to prevent her from

29:27.610 --> 29:29.010
going to prison for so long?

29:30.420 --> 29:32.210
Because I thought, I thought she was

29:32.210 --> 29:34.483
gonna do seven, eight years the longest.

29:35.400 --> 29:37.840
And then she\'d be out and living her life.

29:37.840 --> 29:39.340
But knowing she\'s been in there for

29:39.340 --> 29:44.340
this 20 years is frustrating, it\'s sad.

29:51.750 --> 29:54.113
- I\'m not asking to be exonerated,

29:55.840 --> 29:58.183
I\'m just saying when is enough, enough?

30:00.700 --> 30:04.403
I married Sam when I was 18, I\'m 62.

30:07.000 --> 30:10.523
How long am I supposed to remain in this relationship?

30:12.270 --> 30:13.870
It\'s the only one I\'ve ever had.

30:21.521 --> 30:24.171
- [Brenda] We got legally married on July 5th of \'82.

30:26.420 --> 30:30.710
And about a week and half, almost two weeks after

30:30.710 --> 30:35.010
we got married, I was beat up the first time.

30:35.010 --> 30:36.867
- [News Anchor] Brenda Clubine killed her husband.

30:36.867 --> 30:39.540
- The people versus Brenda Clubine.

30:39.540 --> 30:40.700
- [Brenda] When he raised his arm

30:40.700 --> 30:43.876
the only thing I thought of was, he was gonna hit me.

30:43.876 --> 30:46.540
And I thought that wasn\'t gonna happen again.

30:46.540 --> 30:49.030
I wouldn\'t go through it again.

30:49.030 --> 30:51.830
And that\'s when I picked up the bottle and

30:51.830 --> 30:53.960
hit him over the head with the bottle.

30:53.960 --> 30:56.250
- It is the run in sentence of this court

30:56.250 --> 30:58.400
that for the crime of violation of

30:58.400 --> 31:01.130
section 187 of the penal code.

31:01.130 --> 31:03.603
Murder of the second degree, a felony,

31:05.290 --> 31:08.830
that the defendant be imprisoned in the state prison

31:08.830 --> 31:11.000
for the term prescribed by law,

31:11.000 --> 31:13.383
which is 15 years to life in prison.

31:17.678 --> 31:22.143
- When my jury convicted me for second degree murder,

31:25.850 --> 31:30.850
I knew then that it was over for me and my son.

31:34.400 --> 31:37.007
The judge said, \"I have to recommend your son

31:37.007 --> 31:39.207
\"to the California Department of Adoptions.\"

31:41.700 --> 31:44.863
He was not quite three years old.

31:47.318 --> 31:50.775
So we played, he wrote all over the judges desk

31:50.775 --> 31:52.160
and he was scribbling and he was

31:52.160 --> 31:56.143
all over the room, just as cute as a button.

31:57.100 --> 32:00.770
And she said, \"Okay, I can hold on to this for 30 days.\"

32:00.770 --> 32:04.347
I said, \"If you do, I\'ll change my mind

32:04.347 --> 32:08.277
\"and I\'ll make it about me, I have to make it about

32:08.277 --> 32:11.203
\"him and I have to let go now.

32:12.227 --> 32:15.700
\"So, you need to file this today, please.\"

32:15.700 --> 32:17.007
And she said, \"Okay.\"

32:19.618 --> 32:21.613
It was a horrible, heart hurt pain.

32:25.940 --> 32:28.533
Then when they told me that Joey was killed,

32:29.460 --> 32:33.943
on July the 26th of 1987, I gave up.

32:35.340 --> 32:38.887
I stopped eating, I didn\'t wanna go to work

32:38.887 --> 32:43.320
I couldn\'t be around anybody, I ended up on suicide watch

32:43.320 --> 32:45.420
and I ended up having a nervous breakdown.

32:47.750 --> 32:49.513
Because that was so final.

32:50.350 --> 32:54.330
I had dreamed in my head, from the moment that I let him go,

32:54.330 --> 32:55.860
that one day I\'d have the chance

32:55.860 --> 32:57.880
to tell him that I didn\'t give him up

32:57.880 --> 33:00.850
because I didn\'t love him, that it was because

33:00.850 --> 33:03.023
I loved him that I gave him up,

33:05.265 --> 33:07.090
that, that was the hardest decision

33:07.090 --> 33:09.113
I ever had to make in my life.

33:14.467 --> 33:18.603
I was robbed of that, that was taken away from me.

33:23.300 --> 33:25.970
That was, it was final, there was nothing,

33:25.970 --> 33:27.293
there was no hope left.

33:38.170 --> 33:40.998
So on one night, there was a crossroad

33:40.998 --> 33:43.670
and there was a decision I had to make.

33:43.670 --> 33:46.520
I was either gonna commit suicide that night,

33:46.520 --> 33:51.520
and I made a conscious decision, or I was going to make it.

33:52.400 --> 33:55.690
I was going to do something, I was gonna start a group

33:55.690 --> 34:00.653
where we all could understand what was going on.

34:01.670 --> 34:03.020
What was the problem?

34:03.020 --> 34:07.303
How do we learn why we keep being peoples victims?

34:09.540 --> 34:13.190
I\'ve had all these people over the years saying,

34:13.190 --> 34:16.460
oh, that didn\'t happen, you weren\'t abused.

34:16.460 --> 34:19.072
And I\'ve been so damaged, even

34:19.072 --> 34:22.420
since I\'ve been in prison, by that.

34:22.420 --> 34:26.181
And it was that one night that, that decision

34:26.181 --> 34:30.563
just became the conviction of my heart and still is today.

34:32.909 --> 34:37.230
When I hear Brenda Crosleys pain and what she went through,

34:37.230 --> 34:40.630
When I hear Rosemary Dyers pain and what she went through,

34:40.630 --> 34:44.733
I saw what it\'s cost, what the damage has done.

34:46.210 --> 34:50.407
So, I just wrote a simple letter, asking the Governor,

34:50.407 --> 34:52.067
\"We\'ve been in prison for multiple years,

34:52.067 --> 34:54.277
\"we\'re abused women, we\'ve suffered,

34:54.277 --> 34:55.840
\"we are offenders but we\'re victims.\"

34:55.840 --> 34:59.219
Da, da, da and everybody signed it.

34:59.219 --> 35:02.300
There were either 32 or 34 of us,

35:02.300 --> 35:05.063
total and I mailed it.

35:07.030 --> 35:12.020
And before I knew it, there was this big wow, you know?

35:12.020 --> 35:14.370
The Governors office responded back

35:14.370 --> 35:17.640
and they were gonna look into these cases

35:17.640 --> 35:20.670
and so all of the sudden, the California Women\'s Caucus

35:20.670 --> 35:22.380
wrote me back and the Chair person

35:22.380 --> 35:26.270
at the time was Jackie Speier, Assemblywoman Speier.

35:26.270 --> 35:28.907
And she said, \"Hey, I wanna come down,

35:28.907 --> 35:30.780
\"I wanna hold a public hearing.\"

35:30.780 --> 35:32.830
Da, da, da, da, da and I was like, \"Wow.\"

35:35.830 --> 35:37.560
- I\'m going to ask at this time

35:37.560 --> 35:41.453
the women that are here to testify to please come forward.

35:44.220 --> 35:47.910
- My name is Glenda Crosley, I\'m 56 years old

35:47.910 --> 35:52.750
and I\'m doing life in prison for killing my husband in 1986.

35:52.750 --> 35:55.670
The law to allow evidence of battered women syndrome

35:55.670 --> 35:58.470
did not happen until 1992,

35:58.470 --> 36:00.763
four years after I came to prison.

36:02.190 --> 36:04.790
- Well, in \'92 the legislature passed

36:04.790 --> 36:08.170
the evidence code, section 1107,

36:08.170 --> 36:13.170
which allowed this expert testimony as admissible evidence.

36:14.510 --> 36:19.510
CWAA got people to be interested in that issue.

36:20.330 --> 36:22.880
- We need all our sisters home, our families are

36:22.880 --> 36:25.720
missing their mothers, their daughters.

36:25.720 --> 36:29.140
- Their efforts led to the legislation in 2002,

36:29.140 --> 36:31.700
which gave them the right to go back to court

36:31.700 --> 36:34.120
on habeas petition, about ten years

36:34.120 --> 36:36.860
after they started the effort.

36:36.860 --> 36:40.210
It was a incredibly significant achievement

36:40.210 --> 36:42.220
and particularly given the fact that

36:42.220 --> 36:45.130
it was started by a group of women who

36:45.130 --> 36:48.303
were incarcerated to serving life sentences.

36:57.810 --> 37:00.680
- [Man] It\'s amazing to see all these women,

37:00.680 --> 37:02.513
all from different backgrounds.

37:05.150 --> 37:06.900
You know, it just could be anybody.

37:07.999 --> 37:12.273
And unfortunately, one of those people was my mom.

37:14.710 --> 37:17.190
It was so scary and nerve wracking for me to

37:17.190 --> 37:20.513
be able to make that effort to try and reach out to her.

37:23.890 --> 37:25.940
- I got a letter, boy did I get a letter.

37:27.140 --> 37:31.310
I got a letter from my son and I look at this

37:31.310 --> 37:34.440
collage of photos and I go, \"Oh my god.\"

37:34.440 --> 37:36.330
And all I could really focus on is that

37:36.330 --> 37:39.413
you\'re the miracle I prayed for, for so many years.

37:40.660 --> 37:41.963
You are my miracle.

37:46.150 --> 37:50.600
I was so frightened that he\'d be ashamed of me.

37:50.600 --> 37:51.918
I know he\'d written that he said that he was

37:51.918 --> 37:54.610
proud of me and was happy that I\'d done

37:54.610 --> 37:59.370
what I\'d done with CWAA but it just,

37:59.370 --> 38:01.090
that didn\'t seem real for me,

38:01.090 --> 38:04.300
I needed to hear it from him face to face.

38:04.300 --> 38:06.070
So I\'m looking for, I go, is there a phone number,

38:06.070 --> 38:07.743
is there a phone number, what is there?

38:07.743 --> 38:10.200
- [Operator] I have a collect call from,

38:10.200 --> 38:12.210
- [Brenda] Mom.

38:12.210 --> 38:15.080
- [Operator] An inmate at California Institution

38:15.080 --> 38:17.485
for Women in Chino, California.

38:17.485 --> 38:18.470
To accept,

38:18.470 --> 38:22.270
- I had, like, 30 people were standing around me

38:22.270 --> 38:24.130
in the foyer, looking at me while

38:24.130 --> 38:27.540
I\'m on the phone for my first phone call.

38:27.540 --> 38:30.330
And they\'re all crying cause I\'m boo hoo-ing

38:30.330 --> 38:33.660
like a crazy person, I\'m going, \"Oh my god!\"

38:33.660 --> 38:35.780
I talked to my son.

38:35.780 --> 38:37.380
It\'s about time, huh?

38:37.380 --> 38:40.226
- Yeah, it definitely is.

38:40.226 --> 38:42.207
- [Brenda] They can\'t take this from us, can they?

38:42.207 --> 38:45.660
- No, not anymore I don\'t think they

38:45.660 --> 38:47.920
could take anything else from us.

38:47.920 --> 38:51.040
- [Brenda] You know, I just wanna make everything right.

38:51.040 --> 38:52.420
I have to remember that I can\'t

38:52.420 --> 38:57.420
make up for what\'s gone, I can, we can only go forward.

38:57.820 --> 39:02.150
- He\'s a man, he\'s not Joey, I can\'t stand that.

39:02.150 --> 39:05.329
He\'s not Joey, he\'s Joe.

39:05.329 --> 39:10.329
He\'s almost 27 years old, he\'s a man and he\'s a father.

39:11.810 --> 39:14.830
- You have given me just, such pride

39:14.830 --> 39:18.330
and where I came from and who I am and just,

39:18.330 --> 39:20.750
I\'ve never had so much self esteem

39:20.750 --> 39:24.463
and self confidence and it\'s just amazing.

39:25.380 --> 39:27.690
- I\'ve been so high on cloud nine

39:29.360 --> 39:31.940
that I could hardly breathe.

39:31.940 --> 39:33.630
And everybody knows about him,

39:33.630 --> 39:35.510
whether they know me or not, I don\'t care,

39:35.510 --> 39:38.502
the whole prison knows about my son now.

39:38.502 --> 39:40.460
It doesn\'t matter if they know me,

39:40.460 --> 39:42.780
I\'ve shown everybody pictures, look, look, look.

39:42.780 --> 39:45.223
You know, I don\'t care.

39:46.370 --> 39:48.530
And the most amazing thing about it is,

39:48.530 --> 39:51.660
is that day after that, I got a call from my attorney

39:52.730 --> 39:55.190
that an evidentiary hearing was granted

39:55.190 --> 39:58.960
and that they\'re talking about instead, offering me a plea.

39:58.960 --> 40:01.810
And I got the call about my court hearing.

40:01.810 --> 40:04.220
There\'s a reason that it all happened

40:04.220 --> 40:07.766
at this time and all together, isn\'t that cool?

40:07.766 --> 40:09.446
- Yes, it\'s very cool.

40:09.446 --> 40:12.446
- [Brenda] How do you say it, Sweet?

40:13.991 --> 40:15.824
- Yeah, that is sweet.

40:17.401 --> 40:19.177
- [Brenda] God, I love you so much.

40:19.177 --> 40:21.004
- I love you so much too, mom.

40:21.004 --> 40:22.710
- [Brenda] I\'ve missed so much

40:22.710 --> 40:25.087
and I can\'t, I just can\'t wait.

40:26.075 --> 40:28.075
I absolutely can\'t wait.

40:29.840 --> 40:33.300
- Pro bono attorneys gave her the opportunity

40:33.300 --> 40:35.730
to go back to court on a habeas petition

40:35.730 --> 40:40.730
and try to get her conviction set aside and a new trial.

40:41.667 --> 40:46.667
Between 1992 and 2002, she didn\'t have that option.

40:46.697 --> 40:49.627
She just had a conviction that she could look

40:49.627 --> 40:52.650
at the new evidence code and say to herself,

40:52.650 --> 40:55.713
well had I gone to trial after 2002,

40:55.713 --> 40:58.450
I might\'ve had the more fair trial.

40:58.450 --> 41:03.433
It wasn\'t until 2002 when she was given the option.

41:04.340 --> 41:06.870
But that\'s still a long process,

41:06.870 --> 41:08.490
the fact that the judge is willing

41:08.490 --> 41:11.993
to hear the case is certainly a good sign.

41:14.332 --> 41:17.050
- Most women don\'t even have documentation,

41:17.050 --> 41:18.540
they don\'t have eyewitnesses,

41:18.540 --> 41:20.410
they don\'t have all these things.

41:20.410 --> 41:22.153
I have all this evidence.

41:23.670 --> 41:26.840
From that moment on, I knew that

41:26.840 --> 41:28.873
this is the beginning of the end.

41:29.832 --> 41:34.330
And then it\'s the beginning all over again,

41:34.330 --> 41:35.403
it\'s my new life.

41:37.590 --> 41:40.700
But I can\'t leave here and leave my hearts conviction,

41:40.700 --> 41:43.023
I can\'t, it doesn\'t stop here.

41:44.390 --> 41:47.300
Because I believe with every fiber of my being

41:47.300 --> 41:49.410
that I can still make a difference.

41:56.130 --> 41:59.610
- I see some amazing women in this group.

41:59.610 --> 42:02.440
And I remember when just about

42:02.440 --> 42:05.900
each and every one of you got here, okay?

42:05.900 --> 42:08.910
And you\'ve grown so immensely

42:09.940 --> 42:12.443
and you\'re not that victim anymore.

42:14.060 --> 42:16.810
- There\'s people sitting in this room I know,

42:16.810 --> 42:18.590
never for a million years,

42:18.590 --> 42:22.610
thought that this could be them.

42:22.610 --> 42:24.710
That they could be sitting here.

42:24.710 --> 42:26.890
Glenda, I know you never thought

42:26.890 --> 42:28.950
that you would be in prison.

42:28.950 --> 42:31.853
You were married for 25 years to this man.

42:34.170 --> 42:36.460
- But it\'s important to recognize that

42:36.460 --> 42:40.120
if you\'re in a situation and it isn\'t good,

42:40.120 --> 42:41.890
you\'ve gotta get out.

42:41.890 --> 42:43.540
You\'ve gotta get out.

42:43.540 --> 42:46.063
If I had gotten out, I wouldn\'t be here.

42:47.980 --> 42:51.930
If I could just say one thing to a young woman

42:51.930 --> 42:56.930
who\'s beginning in her life, if you feel trapped, you are.

42:59.259 --> 43:01.310
- And that\'s what this group has always been about.

43:01.310 --> 43:04.350
It\'s never been about staying in that victim role.

43:04.350 --> 43:08.450
It\'s about moving forward and making a difference somewhere

43:08.450 --> 43:12.000
because, nobody understands until they\'re educated, correct?

43:12.000 --> 43:12.833
- [Woman] Right.

43:12.833 --> 43:14.190
- Okay, that\'s where it starts,

43:14.190 --> 43:15.743
It starts with education.

43:19.400 --> 43:21.220
- They want to help other people.

43:21.220 --> 43:23.470
They look beyond themselves, they don\'t want

43:23.470 --> 43:25.510
others to go through what they\'ve been through.

43:25.510 --> 43:28.350
They want men to know how to treat women,

43:28.350 --> 43:31.750
they want their sons to know how to treat girlfriends,

43:31.750 --> 43:33.650
they want their daughters to know that

43:33.650 --> 43:36.240
they\'re worthy of all respect and that women

43:36.240 --> 43:38.660
are able to make decisions about their own lives

43:38.660 --> 43:41.730
and that a woman is a whole person even if she\'s single

43:41.730 --> 43:44.690
and all these things that they didn\'t understand before.

43:44.690 --> 43:46.440
And that it\'s okay to make decisions

43:46.440 --> 43:49.893
to help yourself to be healthy and to be safe.

43:51.590 --> 43:54.950
- Stop ignoring it, everybody needs to stop ignoring it.

43:54.950 --> 43:58.350
It\'s not gonna go away, we can\'t eradicate it.

43:58.350 --> 43:59.803
But we can make it better.

44:01.350 --> 44:04.810
The thing is, is it takes energy to make it better.

44:04.810 --> 44:06.600
And it takes people caring and

44:06.600 --> 44:08.750
having a conviction of their heart

44:08.750 --> 44:10.960
and wanting to follow through.

44:10.960 --> 44:14.443
Just like CWAA, I followed through.

44:19.630 --> 44:21.650
- It would be so easy to crawl into

44:21.650 --> 44:24.363
a corner and pull a blanket over yourself.

44:25.440 --> 44:27.810
But these women, they seek to

44:27.810 --> 44:29.853
educate anybody who will listen.

44:31.280 --> 44:33.390
And they try to keep others from

44:33.390 --> 44:35.490
following the same path that they were on.

44:37.010 --> 44:38.930
We have to learn from their experiences

44:38.930 --> 44:40.970
and learn from them so that we can

44:40.970 --> 44:43.083
help those on the outside.

44:44.070 --> 44:47.570
They are too valuable to keep hidden away.

44:47.570 --> 44:52.570
And their voices are too important to be silenced.

44:55.500 --> 44:57.664
- Little people in the front.

44:57.664 --> 44:58.497
- Here we go.

45:01.856 --> 45:03.882
♪ Now you do it on your own ♪

45:03.882 --> 45:05.606
♪ But you find you\'re all alone ♪

45:05.606 --> 45:09.976
♪ What can you do? ♪

45:09.976 --> 45:14.976
♪ You and me walk on, walk on, walk on ♪

45:16.712 --> 45:21.712
♪ \'Cause you can\'t go back now ♪

45:21.872 --> 45:23.363
♪ You know there will be days ♪

45:23.363 --> 45:24.694
♪ When you\'re so tired ♪

45:24.694 --> 45:29.694
♪ That you can\'t take another step ♪

45:29.766 --> 45:31.464
♪ The night will have no stars ♪

45:31.464 --> 45:33.344
♪ And you\'ll think you\'ve gone as far ♪

45:33.344 --> 45:35.144
♪ As you will ever get ♪

45:35.144 --> 45:37.433
- We gotta spot right here.

45:37.433 --> 45:42.433
♪ You and me walk on, walk on, walk on ♪

45:44.787 --> 45:49.395
♪ \'Cause you can\'t go back now ♪

45:49.395 --> 45:53.417
♪ And yeah, yeah ♪

45:53.417 --> 45:57.715
♪ You go where you wanna go ♪

45:57.715 --> 46:01.833
♪ Yeah, yeah ♪

46:01.833 --> 46:05.797
♪ Be what you wanna be ♪

46:05.797 --> 46:10.547
♪ If you ever turn around, you\'ll see me ♪

46:17.918 --> 46:19.438
♪ I can\'t really say ♪

46:19.438 --> 46:24.438
♪ Why everybody wishes they were somewhere else ♪

46:25.409 --> 46:28.158
♪ But in the end the only steps that matter ♪

46:28.158 --> 46:33.158
♪ Are the ones you take all by yourself ♪

46:33.697 --> 46:38.697
♪ You and me walk on, walk on, walk on ♪

46:41.387 --> 46:45.596
♪ Yeah, you and me ♪

46:45.596 --> 46:48.697
♪ Walk on, walk on, walk on ♪

46:48.697 --> 46:49.940
♪ Cause you can\'t go back now ♪

46:49.940 --> 46:51.290
- [Judge] We are on the record in the matter

46:51.290 --> 46:53.750
of The people versus Brenda Clubine.

46:55.011 --> 46:56.811
- [Brenda] I believe that it\'s time.

46:58.190 --> 47:02.100
Police reports, hospital records, expert testimony,

47:02.100 --> 47:05.973
all of these things are being submitted to court in my writ.

47:07.380 --> 47:10.000
It was all meant to be right at this point in time

47:10.870 --> 47:15.400
because I have my son and my freedom

47:15.400 --> 47:18.603
is just a short distance away now.

47:21.130 --> 47:23.240
- [Judge] Pursuant to 1473.5,

47:23.240 --> 47:25.310
I\'m modifying the judgment in this case.

47:25.310 --> 47:28.210
Her credits include 26 years of custody credits.

47:28.210 --> 47:30.280
I don\'t know how you\'re going to enter that into

47:30.280 --> 47:33.763
the computer, but I\'m ordering her release forthwith.

47:37.440 --> 47:38.937
Good luck to you ma\'am.

47:41.003 --> 47:42.003
- Thank you.

48:01.834 --> 48:05.380
♪ And you and me ♪

48:05.380 --> 48:09.240
♪ Walk on, walk on, walk on ♪

48:09.240 --> 48:13.391
♪ Yeah you and me ♪

48:13.391 --> 48:16.719
♪ Walk on, walk on, walk on ♪

48:16.719 --> 48:21.719
♪ \'Cause you can\'t go back now ♪

48:21.849 --> 48:25.602
♪ Yeah, yeah ♪

48:25.602 --> 48:29.651
♪ You go where you wanna go ♪

48:29.651 --> 48:33.880
♪ Yeah, yeah ♪

48:33.880 --> 48:37.777
♪ Be what you wanna be ♪

48:37.777 --> 48:42.777
♪ If you ever turn around, you\'ll see me ♪

48:45.370 --> 48:48.946
♪ Walk on, walk on, walk on ♪

48:48.946 --> 48:53.427
♪ Cause you can\'t go back now ♪

48:53.427 --> 48:56.707
♪ Walk on, walk on, walk on ♪

48:56.707 --> 49:01.387
♪ You can\'t go back now ♪

49:01.387 --> 49:04.802
♪ Walk on, walk on, walk on ♪

49:04.802 --> 49:08.219
♪ You can\'t go back now ♪