WEBVTT

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He had come back from… from the East coast,

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Chicago and New York. He… His
overbearing manner, (inaudible)

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threw him out(ph), his friends. So,
he came back here, had no job,

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no place to live, and I said
to him \"I have got that room,

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you can stay here for two to two and
a half years until you get a job

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and get your own place.\" In the meantime,

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he was taking over control of my mind,
It got to the point where I felt about,

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so about two inches tall and
he think that I wanted to do

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I had to ask permission with my own money.
I see something in a catalog

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or in a newspaper and I say \"Is
it okay, if I order that?\"

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He was cosigner on my bank accounts.

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I had my, my check register
was messed up, he go that,

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when the bills came in, we had a little container where
we put the bills and at the beginning of each month,

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we take that bills out, he would look at
the bills write the check and signed it

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and then have me check it
before I mailed it out.

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I wasn’t even allowed to write a check and I knew
something was wrong, but a mother is a mother,

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you don’t want to think that way.
I was unaware that he was using

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one of my credit cards to buy tools.
He would go over to the store,

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buy certain tools, use my credit card,
two or three days later he come,

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go back there with the tool, it doesn’t work
right and instead of putting the amount

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back into my account, he demanded the
cash, and they gave him the cash

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because he was on the account. But he
is, from the time he was a teenager,

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he was always there with his handout… he’s gonna have this and that and
the other thing. So, I thought well, that’s the part of his personality.

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Did Berry ever call your names?

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No, he never… he… he never used a bad name

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or bad word to me. He never laid a hand
on me! He was always there to help,

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but even doing taking care of
this house, he took charge of it

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because he was planning to make it his own.
He had underhandedly

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coursed me into signing
into a reverse mortgage.

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I didn’t understand it because the sales
person was talking to him, not to me.

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He also the beginning about the year…

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just about six months before, we kicked
him out, had drawn up a petition,

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how he did it, I don’t know,
but he drew up a petition

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to have me declared incompetent and put
into a home and forged my signature on it.

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The family said well, he is
there, he is taking care of mom,

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we shouldn’t bother her like
she calls us… asking for help.

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I didn’t feel I needed to get
any help from the family,

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but call me once in a while, let me
know that that you think about me.

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While I got to the point where
he would monitor my calls.

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Stand at the end of the one hall to
make sure I didn’t tell them anything

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and he keeps saying don’t tell them
anything, don’t tell them anything.

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While I got to the point where, they were afraid
to say anything to me, to contact me at all.

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Until, my blessed granddaughter

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talked to me to coming. Let’s
see what’s wrong with grandma,

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I don’t like the way as things are
going on. They all came together,

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he was there at the house and he
knew something was happening,

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he went in to call his daughter and son
from riverside and they came down,

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and the family said we don’t like what you have been
doing to grandma or mom, we would like you to leave

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for two to three weeks, until we
get some stuffs straightened out.

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So, they were there and my oldest
daughter came in from Phoenix

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to stay with me almost a month, to make sure
that I was able to handle things alone.

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And it seems though all of a sudden

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as soon as he was out of the
house, a door opened up for me,

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I was no longer afraid to
look around to do things,

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to ask for… for help from people.

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Four days after we kicked him out,
my oldest daughter took me shopping

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and she reported back to the family.
There is nothing wrong with mom,

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she does compare of shopping, she knows how to
use queue punch, she known how to handle money.

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She is back to where she
was almost six years ago.

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March 7th, I had filed a… a complaint

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against him for senior mental abuse.
When I realized

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actually what he had done mentally,

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I decided that’s not the way
I want to live anymore.

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As I said, I took him to court, the judge
listened to my case, asked him what, what,

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how he felt about and he says mom couldn’t
even remember what medicines to take,

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when to take them. He (inaudible) about all that stuff
on the computer and I had right there available.

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Mom can’t do anything, she is
too weak to do this and that,

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and of course at my age, I can’t do a
lot of things, but he made me feel like

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I was a little puppy dog. When the judge
finished talking to him, he says…

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he looked at the papers, he
says \"You are 90,\" he says…

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there is nothing wrong with your… brain, he
says you’d have ever… all your faculties.

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He says that you wanna do something, I said
yes, I would like to have a restraining orders

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for three years, so that was granted.

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But then thanks to the good lord,

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I met Carol and Carol got me
uh… into the human options

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and they actually saved my life

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because I thought like a lot
of women, I’m the only one it,

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it doesn’t happen to anybody else,
I don’t understand what it is.

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It took me two to three meetings
before I was able to talk

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and tell them what the situation was,
and I felt like the weight of the world

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went off my shoulders. I’m
my own person back to where

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I was six years ago before. So, you’ve resented
all the powers of attorney that you gave Berry?

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Yes. And you have changed your healthcare, durable
power of attorney. Yes, and I feel like a free person

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like my life has come back
to me the way I wanted.

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I am able to, if I don’t want to go
any place or do anything, I don’t,

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I do what I want and as I say
I’m not reluctant to say no.

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Is it… you’re good to say no? It feel
(inaudible) getting chills up and down

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my spine, just thinking of it.
The… the… the freedom

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of that has been so uplifting.

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[music]

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Suppose, as I said before I’m not gonna
let anybody going to be round anymore.

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I’m… an older woman,

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but I kept my brain is still good, I can do a lot of things
for myself, if I need help, I have got people to turn to me.

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Well, my son uh…

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as a restless soul. He means well,

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he has a lot of talents, varied
talents, he is a hard worker,

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he is very (inaudible) and
uh… I would say probably a…

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a perfectionist. Ray’s father died

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when Ray was barely six,
he had 10 days to go

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before his birthday to six, and from that
time on Ray felt like he was the man

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with a family and he was never truly
his age. He became quite profession

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in auto-mechanics and aero
plane mechanics et cetera,

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and that was his dear love and,
and then cars, working on cars

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for everybody and one thing led
to another to another, to another

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and he took possession of roads. In
other words, you can drive behind me,

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but don’t try to get in front of me.

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Uh… he caused a car that he was chasing to,

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to get the drivers, the license
number to run a red light

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and that car hit a car and caused an
accident and that’s how put him in jail.

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Well, that’s where his
uh… first real sessions

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with the prison system came into fair.

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Well, from that time on there is no,

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no working with him. no, oh, let put it.
No bringing him

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to face up to his responsibilities. He didn’t
face up to that when or what led to it.

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He lost his driver’s license
and that on a permanent basis

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and cars, automobiles anything, uh… trucks,

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aero planes, you name it anything that
need a license for he was denied.

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It meant that he couldn’t drive, so I did.

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I drove him for drive for job
interviews, and for jobs

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doing from when he was working.
Uh… that went on for fifteen,

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fifteen years, I mean it
sounds like a long time

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and it was, but I think he’s
resentment grew because

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he resented the fact that mom I had to take him
here, mom I had to pick him and all the rest, but

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and there was nothing else we could do about it, I mean if he is going to
get work, he was either gonna have to drive himself or I would have to.

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And that just went on, on and
then finally it got to a point

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where he started destroying

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parts of the house, that he get angry that
he called it not anger, but frustration,

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I called it a bit both.
Where he would hit a door,

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go through a door, hit a
wall, put holes in the wall,

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throw chairs through the
uh… umm… patio door,

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and uh… sliding glass, and
uh… I put seven doors

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from the kitchen to the garage.
There’s either a fist or a foot

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that gets through all those doors, and finally, I
have got a door that he couldn’t do that to it.

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But, his verbal attacks were unbearable.

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There wasn’t anything that he
could say nice about me or to me.

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And I know that a lot of that

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was frustration, but on the other
hand uh… could have been said and

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done in a much nicer way. Breaking
things that he’d stand at (inaudible)

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along kitchen uh… kitchen
counter and he would be angry

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and he just wipe off everything
on the kitchen counter

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and the damage flew, he didn’t hit me

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uh… ever, but the verbal abuse
and it would be so loud

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and so constant in the house and outside

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and the neighbors just could not put up with
it. And it, it just got so the neighbors

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were afraid of him and they were
afraid for me. A neighbor put up

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with as much as they could. One Monday morning,
I think it was a Monday and called the police.

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I would go off to mass every morning at
7:03 and when he attacked me and the car

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before I left, when I came home,
they, they had the police there,

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and they said enough,
250 calls they claimed

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were enough and they were gonna(ph) put
up anymore. When they put him in the car,

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he punched out the rare window and he
tried to crawl through the back window,

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so he was really doing
damage to the police car

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and resisting the arrest and what have you.
The sheriff then arrested Ray (inaudible)

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and he contacted the judge for

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an emergency warrant or restraining order,

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and with Carol’s help.

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Umm… Who all else was there (inaudible). There were eight
people in my living room and there was hardly room,

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because Ray was using the living room for building bicycles.
So, there were bicycle parts all over the living room.

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I mean, my house wasn’t my house anymore.
That’s when I met Carol

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and she came and consult me for

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oh, must have been at least six, six weeks in
a row and all of a sudden it dawned on me,

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I mean counseling, I thought
Carol was just being a friend

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coming to visit me and here she let me talk

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and I have never, never been so
great full for that kind of freedom

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that release. Well, I got so that

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we were robbed three times, I, my purse

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and my wallet at different times were stolen.
I’d no sooner get my social security

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and my uh… credit cards back in order

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when it was stolen again, and there is only
one way in and one way out. You have to know,

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how you could get in and how you could
do, what was there. We never caught him

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The police never found any of the
lost material, so we can’t say that

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he was the one, but we strongly believe it.

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His last uh… period when he
had just gotten out of prison

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and was making his report
to the parole officer

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is when he said that he would kill me,
hit hard me, so you could see that

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the control wasn’t there and
that’s what I worry about?

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And that’s the way it stands right.
Right now, I have no idea where he is,

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how he is? And half of me is crying

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bitter dears and the other half is
at peace. I just pray every day,

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many times during the night
that he will open his heart

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and let power him much stronger
than he and stronger than me,

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(inaudible) to help him. That’s the
only way he is going to find peace.

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[sil.]

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My husband died five and a half years ago
and David more or less took over my life.

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And it became more and more verbal abuse,

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calling me names, threatening to kill me.

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When Bob developed cancer and
then he eventually died,

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I was in another hospital at that
time, I had surgery on my neck

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and when I came home he was my caregiver.

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I didn’t have anyone else and he would
leave with a friend and he’d be gone

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and I’d left alone in the house and I had a brace
on, I wasn’t unable to get up and walk around.

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And I didn’t get fit.

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And he would have to take the brace off at night
to unhook it and he would say all I have to do is

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snap your neck and you would be
gone since put you where dad is.

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And I was afraid, I began to develop
to grow more and more fearful,

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and I was scare to tell my children.
I have six children.

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And I didn’t want them to know what I was going
through. He drew a knife on me several times

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and was gonna slice my throat, told me
the night morning, I would not wake up.

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And the last time he drew
knife on me, I was scared,

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and I went to the police, I didn’t call the police
because I was too afraid of what he would do to me.

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And I had a meeting to
go to that afternoon,

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and I was sitting in the meeting and two policemen
walked in and they motioned, come here,

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and they said we have your son in the car, and
they had him handcuffed and took him to jail.

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And he was in jail about three months,

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and I made the mistake again, I’m letting
him back in and it started all over again,

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blaming me for everything in his life

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uh… threw chairs at me,

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kicked my doors, kicked my
walls, put hole in my walls.

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A dog protector services had been out a
number of times, so many had turned them in,

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and I always turned them away, thinking that I could
handle my problem myself, and it got to the point

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where I could not handle my problem myself and
that’s when I stepped out and went to the police,

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and I think it was at that point that my life
began to change. Her situation and mine parallel

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so that is wonderful when
you talk in the group

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that when I say something she knows exactly
where I am coming from and it’s really

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uh… makes you feel good that somebody
else knows where you are coming from.

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Other people can’t understand it, it must they
have been there and unless they have been there…

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unless their mother. My son,
I have two sons, the one is

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about 48 now and the older one is 51. The
51-year-old has lived with my husband

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and myself his whole life.

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And uh…he was into trouble since he
has been a little kid, he was either

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using or drinking, or somebody
was coming after him for money.

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When my husband passed away fairly suddenly

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and John seem to release everything
that he had been holding

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in a way all the years, although he is doing all
sorts of things, but with my husband there,

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it was a different situation,
because my husband and I

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were a team and he knew he couldn’t get
away with the things with my husband

00:20:10.000 --> 00:20:14.999
that he probably could get
away with if I was alone.

00:20:15.000 --> 00:20:19.999
So my husband passed away and uh…

00:20:20.000 --> 00:20:24.999
John was going to be my caregiver and
well that’s really didn’t worked out

00:20:25.000 --> 00:20:29.999
because he’d leave for days
sometime two or three days

00:20:30.000 --> 00:20:34.999
and I be there and luckily I keep food
in the house and everything like that,

00:20:35.000 --> 00:20:39.999
but he just go do his own things for two
or three days and then come back you know

00:20:40.000 --> 00:20:44.999
and then expect to pickup from
that point, and of course he also

00:20:45.000 --> 00:20:49.999
became more easy in his stealing,

00:20:50.000 --> 00:20:55.000
I mean half of my Keepsake(ph)
jewelries disappeared and all that.

00:21:00.000 --> 00:21:04.999
But he came back and stood in the middle of
the street and he uh… told me, he get me

00:21:05.000 --> 00:21:09.999
and he do this and that and whatever you
know and he can’t let go, I mean you know

00:21:10.000 --> 00:21:14.999
he’s gonna be his way or no way.
So he did, he did that again,

00:21:15.000 --> 00:21:19.999
he came back one more time and pounded on
my window, I thought he’s gonna break it

00:21:20.000 --> 00:21:24.999
and I called the police back and I said I don’t
know I’m, it’s first time I have ever felt that way

00:21:25.000 --> 00:21:29.999
that he might come to the window or do something,
so they sent the police back and they,

00:21:30.000 --> 00:21:34.999
they took him in and they
charged him with elder abuse.

00:21:35.000 --> 00:21:39.999
And they told me that my next step would
be to get restraining order against him.

00:21:40.000 --> 00:21:44.999
So the next day, the next day I
went down and I did inquire,

00:21:45.000 --> 00:21:49.999
I just went down to inquire, and
I was taken into an office and,

00:21:50.000 --> 00:21:54.999
and a man approached me and asked me
what’s the problem was and I told him

00:21:55.000 --> 00:21:59.999
and he’s directed it to
the district attorney

00:22:00.000 --> 00:22:04.999
and they filed against him. And took it out
of my hands, I really didn’t have a choice,

00:22:05.000 --> 00:22:09.999
and I got to realize
that he has his choices

00:22:10.000 --> 00:22:14.999
and whatever happens is his problem. He is no
longer my problem, I can’t be his mother forever.

00:22:15.000 --> 00:22:19.999
Once I reached that point that I knew that

00:22:20.000 --> 00:22:24.999
I didn’t have to feel guilty
about the way he was living,

00:22:25.000 --> 00:22:29.999
it made me very, very strong and
I’m able to cope with it now.

00:22:30.000 --> 00:22:34.999
I don’t like it, but I can cope with it and
I know it has to be done that way, so…

00:22:35.000 --> 00:22:39.999
How was that affected the actual
relationship with your son.

00:22:40.000 --> 00:22:44.999
Terrible, we have no
relationship really anymore.

00:22:45.000 --> 00:22:49.999
We used to be very close. I
knew everything about his life

00:22:50.000 --> 00:22:54.999
and now he is very secretive,
tells me nothing and it hurts me

00:22:55.000 --> 00:22:59.999
because I miss the closeness

00:23:00.000 --> 00:23:04.999
and it will never be there
again, but life changes.

00:23:05.000 --> 00:23:09.999
Do you still see your son?
I talk to him on a phone

00:23:10.000 --> 00:23:14.999
and even on the phone he
doesn’t tell me too much

00:23:15.000 --> 00:23:19.999
and usually it goes around to
what he needs from me you know

00:23:20.000 --> 00:23:24.999
and the longer he hears no from
me, it’s becoming less and less

00:23:25.000 --> 00:23:29.999
that he is expecting these
things of me that has come

00:23:30.000 --> 00:23:34.999
to be a good thing, because he realizes that he
is not getting around me the way he used to.

00:23:35.000 --> 00:23:39.999
And I wish he could be in my life,

00:23:40.000 --> 00:23:44.999
I would like him to be in my life,
but I know we can live together,

00:23:45.000 --> 00:23:49.999
but I would like some
sort of a relationship.

00:23:50.000 --> 00:23:54.999
So I am sorry if right now in a trauma because at the present
time he happens to be in the hospital with pneumonia,

00:23:55.000 --> 00:23:59.999
he had been in there about three months ago

00:24:00.000 --> 00:24:04.999
and they put him somewhere to overcome
the pneumonia and whatever and then

00:24:05.000 --> 00:24:09.999
he is 190 days whatever they give
you when you are on Medicare,

00:24:10.000 --> 00:24:14.999
because he is on Medicare disability

00:24:15.000 --> 00:24:19.999
uh… that was over and they said you gotta
leave and he felt so that meant to street

00:24:20.000 --> 00:24:24.999
so and being on the street for a couple of
weeks again pneumonia is right back again

00:24:25.000 --> 00:24:29.999
and as I said he is in hospital now
the last day and so and there I’m now

00:24:30.000 --> 00:24:34.999
and what do I do, how can I help him, but
I know it isn’t my place to help him,

00:24:35.000 --> 00:24:40.000
he has got to do it himself, so severely
trying things and try to figure that out.

00:24:45.000 --> 00:24:49.999
I think he surprised at the change in me.

00:24:50.000 --> 00:24:54.999
It’s what I became much stronger
much, I don’t like myself

00:24:55.000 --> 00:24:59.999
in one respect because I have
become hard, but I have come,

00:25:00.000 --> 00:25:04.999
become hard because I have to, to survive.
I’m not as open,

00:25:05.000 --> 00:25:09.999
I’m not as vulnerable. So do you
see that as a bad characteristic.

00:25:10.000 --> 00:25:14.999
I do and I knew it isn’t, but
I, I just feel that way.

00:25:15.000 --> 00:25:19.999
I may get over that, but at
the point in my life now

00:25:20.000 --> 00:25:24.999
I feel if so it’s really not the
way I want to be perceived.

00:25:25.000 --> 00:25:29.999
Do you think people perceive you that way.
Some people do.

00:25:30.000 --> 00:25:34.999
Some, have they told you so. Yeah. Okay.
Yeah. Would that be Jay(ph)? It would be

00:25:35.000 --> 00:25:39.999
his brother as well. His brother as well. But these are the two people
you have changed because (inaudible)… No, I have many other people

00:25:40.000 --> 00:25:44.999
to deal with, but yeah. They have seen
big changes in me and both of them feel

00:25:45.000 --> 00:25:49.999
that I have gotten much harder.
So, when they use the word hard,

00:25:50.000 --> 00:25:54.999
they obviously use it in a negative way. Yes. Lova, I would
like to have… you know, you say that two people Jay(ph)

00:25:55.000 --> 00:25:59.999
and his brother, those are the two
people let you want the change and show

00:26:00.000 --> 00:26:04.999
that you have some backbone and I know
because David had said the same thing,

00:26:05.000 --> 00:26:09.999
you have changed, you are different. Yes, I’m
different because I don’t let him walk on me anymore,

00:26:10.000 --> 00:26:14.999
and that’s where that strength comes from

00:26:15.000 --> 00:26:19.999
that you are not hard, we don’t see you in
that way. I maybe, maybe the word I should use

00:26:20.000 --> 00:26:24.999
instead of being hard is uh…being uh…

00:26:25.000 --> 00:26:29.999
Firm. Firm, yeah. That’s it.

00:26:30.000 --> 00:26:34.999
Because you are not hard, you are very
caring person. That the only person…

00:26:35.000 --> 00:26:39.999
You have learned to be firm in the right way. Yes.
Okay, I appreciate that. Because that does bother me,

00:26:40.000 --> 00:26:44.999
I don’t like myself (inaudible)… Don’t might bother you because you
are not that kind of a person, but you are that kind of a person

00:26:45.000 --> 00:26:49.999
to Jay(ph) and his brother. Yeah, yeah that’s the word I
get back. And you are asking them to tell the (inaudible)

00:26:50.000 --> 00:26:54.999
and they are resisting because they
think they can (inaudible) you down.

00:26:55.000 --> 00:26:59.999
Yeah, Well that’s it they have always
gotten really what they wanted

00:27:00.000 --> 00:27:04.999
and therefore mother has really changed you
know she has really gotten hard and whatever,

00:27:05.000 --> 00:27:09.999
snow I have just gotten more firm and
expect more of them, I guess. Um… uh…

00:27:10.000 --> 00:27:14.999
And when I don’t get it then, So be it. So be
it, that’s just the way I feel, yeah. So be it.

00:27:15.000 --> 00:27:19.999
Yeah you know. Thank you. I needed that.

00:27:20.000 --> 00:27:24.999
I guess I’m still thinking that there
must be some help somewhere for him,

00:27:25.000 --> 00:27:29.999
but he doesn’t seem to warm it.
And that frustrates me,

00:27:30.000 --> 00:27:34.999
because I would like to organize some
place where he could go or he could stay

00:27:35.000 --> 00:27:39.999
because for him there is no place to go. So
when he is not in the hospital, where is he?

00:27:40.000 --> 00:27:44.999
On the street. On the street. Maybe,
there is a day that will come

00:27:45.000 --> 00:27:49.999
where you and I can both have
the restraining order modified.

00:27:50.000 --> 00:27:54.999
I would like to have mine
modified also. Right.

00:27:55.000 --> 00:27:59.999
Maybe there is a visitation period
to try and to see it maybe you know

00:28:00.000 --> 00:28:04.999
he can handle things differently.
Not to live with me,

00:28:05.000 --> 00:28:09.999
will not happen. My sentiments… But
just, just to be able to talk to them

00:28:10.000 --> 00:28:14.999
and visually see them and
even give them a hug.

00:28:15.000 --> 00:28:19.999
I don’t think a mother ever gives up hope.

00:28:20.000 --> 00:28:24.999
They say it maybe this will never happen, but I don’t think a
mother even is in that position where she will give up hope.

00:28:25.000 --> 00:28:29.999
I agree. And I think
that’s the bottom line,

00:28:30.000 --> 00:28:34.999
I mean you loved him, you will not give
up hope and you just go long day to day

00:28:35.000 --> 00:28:39.999
and accept it and stay strong and continue.

00:28:40.000 --> 00:28:44.999
But it’s a Will you do that? It’s an unconditional
love. Yes, it is. And on that note…

00:28:45.000 --> 00:28:49.999
[sil.]

00:28:50.000 --> 00:28:54.999
When I first had the restraining order
and David went out of the house.

00:28:55.000 --> 00:28:59.999
Uh… I began to set stronger
roots and boundaries in my life

00:29:00.000 --> 00:29:04.999
and then David called

00:29:05.000 --> 00:29:09.999
and wanted to comeback. He had a problem
in the city that he was living in

00:29:10.000 --> 00:29:14.999
and he told me what had happened, and he says
I need to comeback, I need to get out of here

00:29:15.000 --> 00:29:19.999
and I reluctantly let him back.

00:29:20.000 --> 00:29:24.999
I still have some boundaries that I have
setup, that I have not given (inaudible).

00:29:25.000 --> 00:29:29.999
I had holes in my walls

00:29:30.000 --> 00:29:34.999
and I had carpet was ruined,
and since I have fallen back

00:29:35.000 --> 00:29:39.999
and he is back in, he put
a screen up to the window

00:29:40.000 --> 00:29:44.999
and with it just stapled and he says when
he moves out, he will take that out.

00:29:45.000 --> 00:29:49.999
He has not hit my door nor
has he hit my, my windows.

00:29:50.000 --> 00:29:54.999
He still controls my life. I still don’t
control my thermostat or my air conditioning

00:29:55.000 --> 00:29:59.999
that he just blows up if I do.

00:30:00.000 --> 00:30:04.999
Last night, I washed a lot of clothes and I
dried them and I was through about 20 after 9

00:30:05.000 --> 00:30:09.999
and he was angry at me, because
I was using the dryer.

00:30:10.000 --> 00:30:14.999
Just recently, he threw a clock as we had an
argument and he was in, going into the bathroom

00:30:15.000 --> 00:30:19.999
and picked up the clock and threw it at
me and I put my hands up and let hit

00:30:20.000 --> 00:30:24.999
and went on to couch. He hasn’t thrown a
lot of things at me. He has thrown some,

00:30:25.000 --> 00:30:29.999
but mostly he is just losing his temper.

00:30:30.000 --> 00:30:34.999
This time he has been out
since 20th of August

00:30:35.000 --> 00:30:39.999
and since then he has been
in emergency three times

00:30:40.000 --> 00:30:44.999
into other hospital situations and
uh… now he is in a nursing home

00:30:45.000 --> 00:30:49.999
because of his physical health and it
has been deteriorating right lung.

00:30:50.000 --> 00:30:54.999
I don’t say a lot of it wasn’t
his fault, he… he abused

00:30:55.000 --> 00:30:59.999
prescription drugs and he drank, and
he didn’t take care of his body,

00:31:00.000 --> 00:31:04.999
but he had a couple strikes
against him going in with,

00:31:05.000 --> 00:31:09.999
with a physical problem that he, he has.

00:31:10.000 --> 00:31:14.999
So I can, I cannot let it
lie, I mean his mother and I,

00:31:15.000 --> 00:31:19.999
I would take his head in my
hands, that is not allowed.

00:31:20.000 --> 00:31:24.999
We thought once he had done his time
and restraining order was over,

00:31:25.000 --> 00:31:29.999
then when he came back he would be
able to start some sort of a new life

00:31:30.000 --> 00:31:34.999
and our hopes were we could
get back together again

00:31:35.000 --> 00:31:39.999
and we eventually we had wanted to live together, right
now I don’t know whether that would be possible,

00:31:40.000 --> 00:31:44.999
but I would like to be able to see him
and have him for dinner and whatever.

00:31:45.000 --> 00:31:49.999
And I would like to be able
to myself then to judge

00:31:50.000 --> 00:31:54.999
where he is in his life and how he is treating
me and then I can make a decision too

00:31:55.000 --> 00:31:59.999
as to how I treat him back because I’m not going to
treat him the way I used too, I have learned too much.

00:32:00.000 --> 00:32:04.999
And I think he has got to realize
that he is not going to be able to

00:32:05.000 --> 00:32:09.999
control me or get me do to
everything that he wants to do,

00:32:10.000 --> 00:32:14.999
because I have grown just as
much as I hope he has grown.

00:32:15.000 --> 00:32:19.999
I don’t think he just grown as much as I have to
be perfectly honest, but I do I miss him terribly,

00:32:20.000 --> 00:32:24.999
he’s, he’s my only uh… first born son, my
other son lives in Colorado, he has his life.

00:32:25.000 --> 00:32:29.999
Everybody else is dead and we are the only
two people in the family anymore and,

00:32:30.000 --> 00:32:34.999
and I really feel with
his health situation,

00:32:35.000 --> 00:32:39.999
I may lose him before I die and
I hate to have that time lost

00:32:40.000 --> 00:32:44.999
that we haven’t been able to be together,
and I’m very resentful right now that’s,

00:32:45.000 --> 00:32:49.999
that’s where we stand that
they are keeping us apart.

00:32:50.000 --> 00:32:54.999
So we have been working on goals. So let’s talk
about your next goal. What are we working toward,

00:32:55.000 --> 00:32:59.999
what you are working toward, now. I have two number
one goals. Okay. And I really thought him out

00:33:00.000 --> 00:33:04.999
since our last meeting. Tell me about him.
My first one is my hearing aids

00:33:05.000 --> 00:33:09.999
because I don’t hear and that
causes problem with David

00:33:10.000 --> 00:33:14.999
because he gets angry at
me and he calls me name,

00:33:15.000 --> 00:33:19.999
so that’s a number one, a big goal, I need hearing
aids. Uh… the other goal is to get him out.

00:33:20.000 --> 00:33:24.999
And how are you moving toward that goal. We are
working on his getting enough money to get together.

00:33:25.000 --> 00:33:29.999
I’m not furnishing him. He is working

00:33:30.000 --> 00:33:34.999
and he claims he is saving money, I don’t see it.
Have you asked him to prove that he is saving money?

00:33:35.000 --> 00:33:39.999
I don’t dare ask. okay. I can’t
ask him to prove anything.

00:33:40.000 --> 00:33:44.999
We had a very strong bond,
he and I were like this,

00:33:45.000 --> 00:33:49.999
I could I knew what he was thinking and that’s why he didn’t like me
too much because I knew what he was thinking part of the time you know

00:33:50.000 --> 00:33:54.999
and he couldn’t get away with too much.
I have learned to set boundaries

00:33:55.000 --> 00:33:59.999
and not be taken advantage of and
to meet the respect from him

00:34:00.000 --> 00:34:04.999
as much as I need to give him
respect, and treat him as an adult

00:34:05.000 --> 00:34:09.999
and to quit interfering in his life
and let him grow up, which I know

00:34:10.000 --> 00:34:14.999
I was very involved in his life and I wouldn’t
allow him to grow up, I have gotta learn

00:34:15.000 --> 00:34:19.999
even at 53 he’s got to finally
learn to make his own decisions,

00:34:20.000 --> 00:34:24.999
but that would be my dream to be, be, to
have a normal life with my son in my life

00:34:25.000 --> 00:34:29.999
coming for dinners, spending the night,
doing a little repair work for me,

00:34:30.000 --> 00:34:34.999
and maybe going out to dinner, uh…
just the things that people do

00:34:35.000 --> 00:34:39.999
in a normal existence. You
think Jay(ph) wants that.

00:34:40.000 --> 00:34:44.999
He tells me, he does. As he ever
showed you, he does. Yeah. How?

00:34:45.000 --> 00:34:49.999
Jay(ph) has never been when he would,

00:34:50.000 --> 00:34:54.999
he has always been very kind and
loving to me, and very giving to me.

00:34:55.000 --> 00:34:59.999
Of course when he would be using or
drinking that clouds the situation.

00:35:00.000 --> 00:35:04.999
I think deep down, he wants the same thing
I do, that he wants to be there for me.

00:35:05.000 --> 00:35:09.999
We talked about our whole lives that
he was going to be my caregiver

00:35:10.000 --> 00:35:14.999
and take care of me after dad was gone and
I still believe he wants that deep down.

00:35:15.000 --> 00:35:19.999
Whether he is capable of it, I don’t know.

00:35:20.000 --> 00:35:24.999
What if you had figured out, he is not
capable. How would that change your plans?

00:35:25.000 --> 00:35:29.999
Well, then I would have
to switch gears as I say

00:35:30.000 --> 00:35:34.999
and I will have to sell the house for
one thing, go elsewhere to live,

00:35:35.000 --> 00:35:39.999
so that I would not be
dependent on him in that way.

00:35:40.000 --> 00:35:44.999
Uh… I still would like him in my life as,

00:35:45.000 --> 00:35:49.999
as a son, but not as someone that has to be

00:35:50.000 --> 00:35:54.999
taking care of me or anything, because
if he wasn’t capable of doing that well,

00:35:55.000 --> 00:35:59.999
I don’t think he would like it anymore than I
would like it. If he would feels inadequate,

00:36:00.000 --> 00:36:04.999
if he couldn’t take care of me too.

00:36:05.000 --> 00:36:09.999
I want him to have the money to get out, I don’t want
to see him on the street and that’s what I dealing.

00:36:10.000 --> 00:36:14.999
It’s a very hard issue with me because
I could not go to sleep at night,

00:36:15.000 --> 00:36:19.999
if I knew that my son was
sleeping on the street.

00:36:20.000 --> 00:36:24.999
Like if he is sleeps on the street because he is using
his money for drugs and alcohol, whose choice is that?

00:36:25.000 --> 00:36:29.999
[sil.]

00:36:30.000 --> 00:36:34.999
I just, I don’t know Carol, I, I just.

00:36:35.000 --> 00:36:39.999
I understand. I really I have… my heart just
turns flip-flops when I think of my son

00:36:40.000 --> 00:36:44.999
(inaudible) go out on the street. I understand.
We can give him a list of shelters.

00:36:45.000 --> 00:36:49.999
And he has had that list and he has thrown away
every time. So again, if he is on the street,

00:36:50.000 --> 00:36:54.999
like whose choice he is on the street.

00:36:55.000 --> 00:36:59.999
I just, I can’t make an, I just
can’t, I can’t deal with it

00:37:00.000 --> 00:37:05.000
and it’s very, very hard for me because
no matter what he does to me, I love him.

00:37:45.000 --> 00:37:49.999
If you were at the beginning stages
and a social worker came to you,

00:37:50.000 --> 00:37:54.999
what would you tell that professional
now knowing where were you now

00:37:55.000 --> 00:37:59.999
and she came to see you the first day. What could
you tell her you needed? What advise can you give

00:38:00.000 --> 00:38:04.999
to the social service people today, we are
going into the same situations where you were,

00:38:05.000 --> 00:38:09.999
two or three or four years ago. Tell her, there’s
help and there’s hope. That’s it, right there.

00:38:10.000 --> 00:38:14.999
And the opportunity to express yourself.
Again, I go back to the senses,

00:38:15.000 --> 00:38:19.999
hear yourself, tell your story.

00:38:20.000 --> 00:38:24.999
It’s not as bad as you think it is. But at the beginning you
thought. That’s right. Beginning you felt that there was no hope,

00:38:25.000 --> 00:38:29.999
there was no, no chance.
But as time went on

00:38:30.000 --> 00:38:34.999
and we were able to hear ourselves.
What I hear,

00:38:35.000 --> 00:38:39.999
what I’m saying I’m almost
shocked that I put up with this.

00:38:40.000 --> 00:38:44.999
So are you saying that the professionals, who come out and
work with you, one of the things you would advise them,

00:38:45.000 --> 00:38:49.999
if they were to go out with and work with someone like you is to
listen. Absolutely. And listen unconditionally that what you say.

00:38:50.000 --> 00:38:54.999
That’s what you do, Carol.
And you brought me here.

00:38:55.000 --> 00:38:59.999
And the thing also I was going to say is to listen to
what the person is telling you, but to listen to them

00:39:00.000 --> 00:39:04.999
as an individual and not as someone

00:39:05.000 --> 00:39:09.999
in a block of people, who
are in a similar situation.

00:39:10.000 --> 00:39:14.999
Because every situation is, is so different.
That’s it. Don’t try to offer them

00:39:15.000 --> 00:39:19.999
what they can do, right away.

00:39:20.000 --> 00:39:24.999
I mean, people say oh, do it this way. I believe
that this gonna work, but let them talk through

00:39:25.000 --> 00:39:29.999
and listen to what they are saying and
fit that in to what their needs are.

00:39:30.000 --> 00:39:34.999
Six weeks, it took me six
weeks to realize that…

00:39:35.000 --> 00:39:39.999
Longer than that. No how I wasn’t cured.
No, but it took me six weeks

00:39:40.000 --> 00:39:44.999
of talking to Carol. She just let me talk.

00:39:45.000 --> 00:39:49.999
You would have asked me questions, I could even
give you any examples of what you would ask me,

00:39:50.000 --> 00:39:54.999
but you let me talk and
when I heard myself talking

00:39:55.000 --> 00:39:59.999
then I realized what my
situation was, other,

00:40:00.000 --> 00:40:04.999
otherwise I didn’t, but if Carol had come and sit and you
gonna do this and you gonna do this, and you gonna do this,

00:40:05.000 --> 00:40:09.999
I would say wait a minute, wait a minute I am
not there yet. I’m only here, but she didn’t,

00:40:10.000 --> 00:40:14.999
she let me talk and I heard

00:40:15.000 --> 00:40:19.999
what I was saying and I used what little I had
left. What you did is to let you think through

00:40:20.000 --> 00:40:24.999
freed herself what you already knew,

00:40:25.000 --> 00:40:29.999
but didn’t how, know how to… Handle.
Handle, yeah. All right.

00:40:30.000 --> 00:40:34.999
And then she had offer a little bit of advice here and
you know, you would observe that and that just means…

00:40:35.000 --> 00:40:39.999
Little bit at a time. When I realize
that, when I recognize the fact that

00:40:40.000 --> 00:40:44.999
when Carol left and she said \"Well, shall I come
back next week?\" And I thought \"Oh, my Gosh!\"

00:40:45.000 --> 00:40:49.999
I went out and told back in the garage, who…
helper that was getting things ready for our self.

00:40:50.000 --> 00:40:54.999
I should not gonna believe
this, but I’m in counseling

00:40:55.000 --> 00:40:59.999
and I thought me, I
should be in counseling,

00:41:00.000 --> 00:41:04.999
I was that I was so great
full and it didn’t hurt.

00:41:05.000 --> 00:41:09.999
It didn’t hurt and this is what we are afraid
of. We are afraid if we bare our souls

00:41:10.000 --> 00:41:15.320
people will say, oh, for heaven sakes you known why would you do
this, too bad for you, yes… Or forget it Yes, instead she let be me.